RUMCars Forum

General Category => Unusual Microcar Discussion => Topic started by: steven mandell on June 14, 2013, 02:28:38 PM

Title: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on June 14, 2013, 02:28:38 PM
I am in need of a wiring diagram for my 1974 "Sluggy".  
A picture of the under dash wiring would be helpfull also as mine came as a bundle of snakes.
I am also in  need of the rubber drive doughnut that looks like a mini Lotus Elan version of a U joint, taillight lenses, and inside door pulls.
Not to mention an explanation as to why it has two parking brake actuating handles side by side, or what the diagonally sliding pedal just to the left of the shifter is supposed to control.  A cable emanates from this and was found to be hose clamped to the frame and attached to nothing at its end fitting.
 Heightening the curiousness of the set up is the fact that this pedal, in addition to being mounted on a rail in the floor that will only allow a diagonally sliding motion-  is adorned with a rubber pedal face as one would expect to find on a conventional foot actuated mechanism, but you would need to be a double jointed mini me to get your foot on it as it is mounted alongside the shifter!

There is a well engineered looking rear differential integral to the 47 cc Moto Morini motor located about this cable's length distance away from it.  Topping off the mysteries is the fact that the side of the differential opposite the engine looks like an accessory/ alternate drive out put that  remains absolutely unutilized.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: richard on June 21, 2013, 07:37:27 AM
Sorry about the lack of response steve , I suggest you make the topic more relevant or interesting . I have no idea at all what a charley/ snuggy would be so as I have no knowledge no response . I have posted to no response - it sometimes happens - deal with it  ;)
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Bob Purton on June 21, 2013, 09:54:54 AM
Please bare in mind that interest in this sort of vehicle is new to many on the forum , many of us are only interested in cars from what we call the golden age, 1950's and are deemed to be usable on our roads. You seem to have the same mistaken concept about gathering information as you do about acquiring spare parts for very obscure cars, just wheel a shopping trolley around the uk and gather it all up. If only it was that easy! :D As Al said there may only be one example of that brand in the whole country, can I suggest you try its country of origin? Thats what I had to do when I first got into Inters, it was hard but I got there and that was before the Internet.  As an after though, have you tried Dennis, Microcarfan? Does anyone have his contact details?
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Bob Purton on June 21, 2013, 10:09:12 AM
Just noted he is on this forum, user name Dennis, send him a pm. Thats if you dont already know him.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Big Al on June 21, 2013, 12:16:08 PM
Mr Davenport? But then probably really only if he has had or thought of having one. Are these cars anything to do with Sulki?
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on June 21, 2013, 02:13:06 PM
I have had no luck in sending a p.m. to "Dennis" / "Microcarfan", / "Davenport", as the sending software does not recognize any one of these names or combos of same that I have entered.
I must admit, that unless I can see a member's identifying signature to the left of a post, I usually run into this type of problem.
What am I doing wrong?
How is one supposed to efficiently look up a mailing address for a member when one only knows their actual name.
I already posted Jean Doo (sp?) regarding my quests for wiring diagram/  pictures that an owner could easily take.
The cars were made in Italy, but most often sold in France, if I have interpreted clues correctly.
Then again there is still the mystery of the incredible sliding pedal that I noticed was no longer being installed at the time of manufacture of a 1976 "time capsule car" that was for sale on the east coast of the U.S.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: richard on June 21, 2013, 03:06:43 PM
Note from headmaster I can't find a Dennis on the list only a denis - which may be his real name - or was he having a "blond(ie) moment when signing on . You do not escape steven as you suspect -there is  no Jean Doo only a jean-do. Mis-spellings make it impossible to research or indeed search. Once having an I.d. I have never had a problem sending a pm just by clicking send personal message . Getting a reply not always guaranteed - stuart  ;)
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on June 21, 2013, 05:52:08 PM
Having a correct i.d. is the hard part, as my, your, Al's, and Bob's unsuccessful gropings for Dennis' s i.d. / email address would suggest.
The fact that the search feature for finding an i.d. won't help if you leave out a "-", or double even the last letter of an otherwise correctly spelled i.d., doesn't help matters much. 

 Anybody out there have an ability to give this feature a brain boost?  I for one would appreciate it if it became so enabled.

I did escape this time, however, because our fearless moderator personally mailed me Dennis's correct email address,  and I found a post by jean-do, and clicked on his i.d. before sending him my p.m.
 And I don't even like acronyms!
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: richard on June 21, 2013, 06:09:08 PM
ofgs imho you mean pseudonym  ;D
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Bob Purton on June 21, 2013, 06:40:54 PM
All you have to do is look down the list of members until you find the one you want. Its not brain surgery. That is assuming that its not just the moderators that have access to the members list? Is it?
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Big Al on June 21, 2013, 06:58:35 PM
ofgs imho you mean pseudonym  ;D

I like acroprops and snow on me, does that help?

Is this a dyslexia moment? Is it a word or pixel/picture. If its a word, normally remembered. If its a instant visual image, normally remembered. If its just a jumble of letters, especially with numbers, I cannot remember it till I have used it a few times. Names are important, and I to am not a huge fan of Pseudoacroprops, though it is true some become nick names, like Nick Poll, for instance.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: richard on June 21, 2013, 07:33:16 PM
no bob we do all have that facility

don't know where al got mr. davenport but it would appear that he is French , in France and interested in things French so indeed he may have spelt his name correctly as DENIS - these French eh ? not as soft as they are Camembert looking  ;)
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Barry on June 21, 2013, 10:31:47 PM
His name is Denis with one 'n'
You can message him through his website.

www.microcarfan.com

At the moment it seems to be down - probably off collecting Citroen BMX's before their price goes through the roof.

Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: richard on June 21, 2013, 10:34:46 PM
if you email denis as a pm he gets his pm when he views the forum and he also gets an email - sorted , simple
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Big Al on June 22, 2013, 08:27:07 AM
no bob we do all have that facility

don't know where al got mr. davenport but it would appear that he is French , in France and interested in things French so indeed he may have spelt his name correctly as DENIS - these French eh ? not as soft as they are Camembert looking  ;)

He is our friendly neighbourhood Customs man with small cars and mopeds. Perhaps he is not on here anymore, I don't know what his Monica is on here. Which rather proves the point about unreal names don't it?
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Big Al on June 22, 2013, 08:30:05 AM
His name is Denis with one 'n'
You can message him through his website.

www.microcarfan.com

At the moment it seems to be down - probably off collecting Citroen BMX's before their price goes through the roof.



The swine. There all mine, I tell you!

Is the BMX the 4x4 one? Green puddle power to the rescue!
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Big Al on June 22, 2013, 08:41:41 AM
Odd lever theory

A friction drive reverse engagement, friction starter engagement for an unconverted fizzy engine or handy baguette slicer for that irresistible nibble on the way home.

I would love to say James Bond ejector seat but that would be ridiculous in a single seat car, make a right charley of yourself. My Brother suggested it lowers the lawn mower deck, a cutting jibe there, coming in.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Barry on June 22, 2013, 10:56:16 AM
Odd lever theory

A friction drive reverse engagement, friction starter engagement for an unconverted fizzy engine or handy baguette slicer for that irresistible nibble on the way home.

I would love to say James Bond ejector seat but that would be ridiculous in a single seat car, make a right charley of yourself. My Brother suggested it lowers the lawn mower deck, a cutting jibe there, coming in.

Where would we be without your humour Al ? How many can you get-in in one sentence?  Must be a record. 
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on June 22, 2013, 11:42:22 AM
Al- one week of fiddling under the car has put to rest all of your fanciful meanderings re: functions of the car's controls except for one.
As seen in the picture below we have from left to right:

1.) A big pull up and back lever as used most often for a parking brake that causes a clunk to be heard in the rear differential box, and the wheels to reverse their direction of rotation when spinning the unutilized end of the input shaft that protrudes from the diff box casing.
This of course must mean that it is a selector engaged reverse gear engagement rather than a friction drive type.

2.) The next identical looking, but this time - ratcheting lever, is indeed the hand brake that engages both rear wheels.

3.) The much smaller scaled, left most and most forward mounted lever is a cable operated starter engagement device that replaces the function of a modern electrical solenoid, and thus allows an exposed starter sprocket to drive a small bicycle sized gauged set of chains and sprockets that allow for a gear reduction effect.

4.) Its Siamese twin lever mounted directly to the right on the same pivot shaft and concentric return spring is the choke actuator.

5.) There is a conventional hydraulically actuated brake pedal in the forward footwell to be operated by ones right foot.

6.) There is also a conventional accelerator pedal in the right and forward most aspect of the footwell.

7.) There is a shifter shaft that also sprouts a pivot for the T handle that actuates the clutch disengagement.

8.) And last but possibly not least lies that mysterious sliding pedal that lies betwixt # 6 & 7, but on a floor mounted track that allows a good 10 inches of travel along a diagonal path that pulls a heavy cable.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on June 22, 2013, 12:00:43 PM
Might as well show the view from the rear that displays the unutilized rightmost aspect of an input shaft protruding from what looks like a differential housing.  Interesting in that it is equipped with both a woodruf key, that has miraculously avoided be spun out of its slot for all these years, and a retaining bolt that doesn't retain anything.
A perfect time capsule car dating from 2 years later in series production also has this useless appendage, sans woodruff key and retaining nut.

The mystery sliding pedal actuated cable end shown in the last preceeding picture, extends almost to the rear axle centerline in its furthest rearward approach.
Adding more to the mystery is the fact that a 1976 time capsule car shows not a hint of ever having been equipped with this awkwardly placed mystery sliding pedal.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: richard on June 22, 2013, 12:26:38 PM
to all those who like me had NO IDEA what this car is/was heres some online info - quite fun , wish i'd known all along . still no answers from me but even that must be more helpful than al's recent suggestions  :) good luck steven , a pity you cannot contact the new owner of this car

http://classiccarweekly.wordpress.com/tag/snuggy/

headmaster AGAIN despite steven being the owner of one of these it appears not to be as titled " All Cars Charley/Snuggy " but in fact " an All-cars Charly/Snuggy " it may be similar but ......quite different for researching
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on June 22, 2013, 07:22:52 PM
I found this, "the perfect time capsule car" both at its Mecum auction website, and the East coast U.S. dealer advertising it for $12, 500 by searching under the title "All Cars Charly/ Snuggy".
It is referred to as a 1976 model elsewhere.  Unfortunately, this one shows no trace of the by now infamous sliding pedal, as I stated previously.
However a picture of the subdash wiring could still be helpful.
Perhaps a call to the East Coast dealer could still be worthwhile as they have not responded to my email.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on June 22, 2013, 11:07:09 PM
A phone call revealed the new owner to be a resident of Brazil.   The dealer said that he would relay my email address and phone number, so may be possible to get a picture of the wiring if I get lucky.
Just took off the wheel and brake drum to see why the brakes arn't working, and got a better  look around.
You can see the end fitting of the cable from the sliding mystery pedal at full extension in the first photo, and minimally extended by fully sliding the pedal forward in the last photo.
There is a conspicuous hole in a horizontal bracket that extends a few inches rearward of the rearmost extension of the cable housing.
There doesn't appear to be any wear pattern on it, so I don 't know if it is supposed to be a pivot point, bolt hole, spring anchor or what.
Anybody have any ideas about this yet?
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Big Al on June 23, 2013, 02:56:16 AM
Are we looking at the remains of a never fitted hand power option to fit in with this sans permis ruling that seems to have later been dropped? If so then the car may be thus converted in production to have the reversing diff axle of the 'standard' upmarket car? This seems to have kind of happened in the case of the Comtesse/Acoma we looked at. The bracket with the hole looks like it could be a return spring mount to aid action of a ratchet/one way drive system. Just an idea.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: cuscus47 on June 23, 2013, 03:13:06 AM
That is my thought as well, Alan.  All the Sans Permis vehicles I have, have the vestiges of the hand-propulsion ability.  It looks as this is the most probable explanation.  Ian.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Big Al on June 23, 2013, 09:36:40 AM
Found no info on wiring etc. Really only 4 Websites of reportage/sales patter. Someone importing them into the States? The best option looks to be the French chat room, in French.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Denis on August 09, 2013, 12:01:12 PM
Dear Steven, dear all,

Sorry if I give you a reply after such a long time!
From another way, this is the best solution to let you discover all specificities of  Snuggy ;o)
And if I well understand, you have found reply to your all questions!
The diagonal pedal is there to entitle this kind of “ car” to be conceded like a moped…
From French law of the 70/80: The car must can be moved from the human power from his driving place to be accepted like a “cyclomoteur” and so like a without license car.
My Snuggy was at the back of my garage => Impossible for me to take in out for pictures.
Now holidays are here so I have put outside few microcars and taken pictures.
Attached: One about dash board.
And copy about specification of Snuggy ( sorry for quality of this documentation, I don(t own a best one)
For the History, you will notice than Snuggy was sold in France under the Name of Addax, an other builder of sans permis.
I stay at your disposition for all other information about this kind of sans permis and also older microcars…
My  web site is now working well: www.microcarfan.com

Best regards.
Denis  ( with only one “n” ;o)

(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\TABLEAU DE BORD.jpg)
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy1.jpg)
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy2.jpg)
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy3.jpg)
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy4.jpg)
(http://[E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy5.jpg/img][img]E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy6.jpg)
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on August 09, 2013, 12:28:01 PM
Hey Denis,
Thanks for posting.
I'd love to see a picture of the linkages from the sliding pedal to the differential.
Does yours still have this?

Also what exactly are the small chrome switchboxes on the dashboard supposed to controll?
On my car theyare highly underutilized.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: richard on August 09, 2013, 12:31:28 PM
Hi Denis if you want another " n" maybe the schmitt club sell them as well  :D
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Denis on August 10, 2013, 04:25:35 AM
I see pages 1 to 5 are missing in my first message

(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy1.jpg)
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy2.jpg)
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy3.jpg)
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy4.jpg)
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy5.jpg)
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Denis on August 10, 2013, 04:28:28 AM
[img][E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy4.jpg/img]
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Denis on August 10, 2013, 04:29:49 AM
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy3.jpg)
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Denis on August 10, 2013, 04:30:58 AM
[img][E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy2.jpg/img]
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Denis on August 10, 2013, 04:32:02 AM
[img][/E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\snuggy1.jpgimg]
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Denis on August 10, 2013, 04:43:08 AM
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\pignon1.jpg)

(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\pignon2.jpg)

Now Steven,
Just to found something like it on a bicycle or so on.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Denis on August 10, 2013, 04:44:21 AM
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\pignon1.jpg)
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on August 10, 2013, 01:03:24 PM
THANKYOU Denis!
Your picture is worth a thousand words, and definitively solves the great mystery of what the sliding pedal's cable was designed to actuate.
Al had it spot on- a ratcheting spring returned, and only partially reciprocating mechanism to allow a single legged feeble pedal power for the car.
I noticed that by the time of your black and white copy of a brochure came out, that there was no sliding pedal pictured or described with the other controlls.  What year did your legislators drop this silly requirement?  My guess is that it was gone by 1976.

Now if I could just get someone to come up with a similarly illuminating photo of how the more conventionally hung left most, and former "mystery pedal" actuated a similarly self propelling mechanism- in my Mini Comtesse- all the mysteries of the French Fridges will be solved.
Couldn't get more relevant or interesting than that!
Thanks again to Denis and Big Al for successfully solving this many month long mystery.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Denis on August 10, 2013, 03:50:56 PM
Thanks to you, Steven.

I also prefere posting pictures because it isn't always easy to give good technical explication with an English like mine ... " comme ci, comme ça!"

So let see the Acoma solution :
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\minicomtesse pignon1.JPG)
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Denis on August 10, 2013, 03:52:00 PM
(http://E:\Mes Documents\1 DENIS\1 a a MICROCARS\ALL CAR\minicomtesse pignon2.JPG)
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on August 17, 2013, 08:18:29 AM
"Snuggy conquers Concourse!"
Concorso Italiano in Monterey California today that is.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: richard on August 17, 2013, 10:08:53 AM
always nice to see anything new on the circuit  ;)
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on August 19, 2013, 10:50:27 AM
Another day, another Concourse.
This time it was in the Concourse De Lemons.
I just spent quite some time trying to post my smart phone's camera generated images of Dick Tuttle's Peel Trident winning the People's Choice award by an astounding 70% of all votes received,  and an at least equally pleased Scott Boses winning worst in show for the fifth Voisen prototype that he purchased at the Bruce Wiener auction.

The unmitigated Gaul of it all!
For some reason that is a mystery to myself, the Rumcar's software is taking too long to download only 2 camera phone images, and is telling me that my file size is to large, even though I've posted two images at a time, that were both generated  and downloaded by the same camera phone on to this website previously.
This is even happening when I just attempt to upload a single image now.
Anybody know why this limiting inconsistency is occurring?  ???
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: richard on August 19, 2013, 11:07:24 AM
I always have the same problem hence my ice cream van having to be sent as two messages. I think jim installed it to stop us posting our holiday snaps  ;D
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Rusty Chrome (Malcolm Parker) on August 19, 2013, 12:18:48 PM
It wasn't anything to do with that 8" floppy was it?  ;)

I'd love to see the photos, no idea why they aren't loading, but if all else fails email them to me and I'll try to fix them.

Best Regards

Malcolm
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: steven mandell on February 04, 2014, 06:21:31 PM
SNUGGY MAKES WORLDWIDE TELEVISION DEBUT!
Well...for a few seconds anyway.   It is on Wayne Carrini's hit show "Chasing Classic Cars", during the episode where he takes you along to all the famous (and in this case infamous) venues for the annual Monterey car week extravaganza.
It starts out with the $27.5 million auctioning of a 1967 NART Ferrari Spider at RM, and ends with the Concourse De Lemons.  So it goes from the cream of the cream to a laugh and a half.
Do you guys get the series over there?   Its probably been rerun at least a dozen times in the LA area before I noticed it.
I am the mystery man beneath the large brimmed hat.
Title: Re: All Cars Charley/Snuggy
Post by: Big Al on February 04, 2014, 09:43:02 PM
I believe the series is available on one of the satellite channels but I know not which.