RUMCars Forum
General Category => Sales & Auctions => Topic started by: john p on January 16, 2015, 04:58:53 PM
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anglia car auction kings lynn end of jan micro cars in auction scootacar x2 nobel,bonds and berkeley x2
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Too little Information.
Please give us all you can get, including pictures and a link if possible.
Thanks
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Many of us will be going to this auction to try and buy these British cars, why would we want to aid you to outbid us and export them to the USA?
Dont you have enough of our heritage already?
See what happens when people blab about these things on the forum?
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That's twice you've accused me of "blabbing", Bob. It's rude of you, and clearly done for selfish reasons.
If you don't like the intentions of the forum, you could always decide not to read it.
(Because it was rude, and because it's specifically contrary to the intentions of the forum, I have naturally reported your latest post to the moderators.)
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Sorry for any offence caused but it is still my opinion and if one of the moderators wants to remove it then they can.. My motive here is to keep the last few British microcars in the uk.
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I have never been after any Bond, and I find the appearance of Mark 2 Scoots to be less appealing than the Mark ones, that I finally obtained a rust free example of one from Eastern Canada in 2011, after 20 years of trying.
I do like both 3 and 4 wheeled versions of Nobels enough to have purchased one of each. One from Wisconsin in 2009 at the same time as obtaining my AC Petite that needed fabrication of a complete and complex floor and frame rails. The other Nobel came from Eastern Canada also.
Last September I finally landed my long sought after Berkeley with Excelsior triple motor, from Quebec, and am still working out an affordable way to get it to Los Angeles.
The only truly British micro car that I have ever exported from your country was Dave Morgan's FF3, after notice of its availability had first been made on this very same forum several months earlier.
That is unless you include the Trojan that I bought off of Ebay UK that you were kind enough to transport to the docks for me, because owing to both its commonality, and Irish/ German heritage it was not on your personal version of the British endangered species list.
Many California based rust free examples of classic American cars are shipped from our shores by British Dealers and collectors every day.
I also remember members of this forum showing no concern about robbing Americans of their heritage when a "one off" American made micro became available in virtually my back yard, a few years ago.
I have still never sold a single micro car, have at best an only average income, but perhaps prioritize more highly, and therefore persist in my efforts more than most.
If you decide to vilify me for doing what you would commend your own country men for doing- Good day to you sir.
I currently have no other British cars on my "buy before I die" list.
I simply am interested in seeing what is going on in the world of Micro cars, because I am a true enthusiast.
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I consider myself truly reprimanded Steve. A very well measured reply in my view. As you can tell I am very passionate these days about not losing all our rarest microcars to overseas collectors. I guess I could be accused of being a born again Cornockite! [Bond owners will know what that means] You know all this anyway as we have had many a conversation in the past which Dave wouldnt know about. I will leave my post up so people can see just how rude I am when rattled. It was slightly tongue in cheek but can see how that wouldnt have been easily detected by those who dont know us.
The only point I would contend is the one about British folk buying American classics, true but there are an awfull lot of those and very very few microcars now.
Rest assured if I can be of help to you with your currently owned cars I will as I always have done. Live long and prosper. Grumpy Bob
Boy, is that humble pie sticking in my throat! ;D ;D ;D
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The idea of following a forum's intention, Bob, is not that people say inappropriate things and then leave it to the moderators to remove their comments.
The idea is that we don't say inappropriate things in the first place. (Think of litter: not many would respect someone who says "If you don't like my litter, you can always remove it".)
On the forum's home page, we are asked to report, on the forum, when microcars come up for auction on eBay, etc. Perhaps this forum is not for you.
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Surely you dont believe that everyone posting a comment on a forum agrees with every aim and intention of the person who set up the said forum do you? Funny enough the guy who originally set up our forum isnt even a microcar enthusiast.
A forum is to voice ones views is it not? Others dont have to agree with those views.
Me and Steve go back a long way and are quite used to knocking ten bells out of each other, its the kind of relationship we have.
If Steve wants me to remove it I will.
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Apology graciously accepted. :)
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Surely you dont believe that everyone posting a comment on a forum agrees with every aim and intention of the person who set up the said forum do you?
Certainly not. But if you're expecting people not to complain at your non-conformist view, then you should hardly complain at my posting which did conform!
Banter is fine. The Elgin approach to microcar ownership perhaps less so.
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I have no problem with people complaining about my views.
Lets just agree to disagree Dave. I'm sure we would agree on the other 95% of all issues.
Has there ever been talk of setting up a Bond forum?
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I am not sure Bob holds a non conformist view. He voices a common concern over the tendency of the pool of microcars to diminish here, to sales elsewhere. He just voiced this, pressed the button a bit quick, for which he apologised to the party crossed, and has to be quiet, as if he is not politically correct like a Muslim hater or something. Debate is healthy.
There is a serious situation behind this. As the car numbers fall in the UK, so does the activity in them and that effects social activity, buying power for part manufacture in our bit of the world, etc etc. I am a free market supporter, so my take on it is that if the Brits do not pay 'the going rate' they loose the cars. However that does resolve the issue in our favour. The economy currently looks like helping some economies pick up the cars for less of their currency, than for a while.
I think the defence here, and while I know the owner of the cars well, is that the auctioneer selection, regional, and timing, are we all going bto Kings Lynn if it snows, suggest a disappointing menu of top bids. We have watched the vagueness of auctions over the years. In America a Goggo Coupe has just fetch a ridiculous sum of money. This summer a load of 'desirable' Schmitt projects went through for no great values. Most to trade to be turned around for a mark up.
There is the rub. The trade will take microcars now. They underwrite the prices. You want a car you either have to find an off market car ,or pay at least trade price for it. Oddly as a trader, retired, I would not be investing at the prices most cars seem to have reached. There is fresher meat to cook with out there. But many of the trade follow patterns rather than look for new ones.
Its a catch 22. Less cars here, less interest and activity, but the cars are rarer, so the price goes up. That excludes another layer of buyer. And so it goes on. However a good proportion of the cars are moving from single/low ownership owners to multiple owners. So the frequency of sell offs, clearing unwanted collections, in an ageing population, means we will endlessly have these buying contests. There is not the satisfaction of following a tip into the countryside and digging out an unknown car. That's what I get off on. Not the Miss World parade of cars wearing make up. The challenge there is just to beat the other guy. Yet it is only the folk who make new cars available, and the increasing interest world wide that drives this market, which could very well end up like a pyramid selling enterprise where the last guy out with the money in the bank is the winner. Look what has happened to other collectables.
Here is no effective way of keeping the cars in Britain in a world market, that I can think of, but for paying the price it takes to stop the cars going abroad. Unlike some countries I cannot see them being classed as heritage and banned from export. Poor publicity helps to keep them here, of course. Same as it ensures less people at events. I've finally got it! Less people at events, less people wanting a car as they've not been inspired, less local competition to buy up those cars into a collection. How cunning campervan man is.
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Mmmm. You're easily befuddled, Al ;)
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Dear All
I think this discussion has gone far enough, as buyers and sellers will never agree. Sellers want everybody to know so they reach the ears of the highest bidder. The buyers want to be first on the spot and get it for the cheapest price. The true value is presumably somewhere between the two.
The forum has just as much commitment to sellers as buyers, and therefore if sellers want to tell us all they have something to sell, that is perfectly reasonable. Similarly if buyers wish to tell no body that they know that a car or part is for sale, then that is their right to remain silent. For the rest of us who have neither something to sell or to buy, we can choose if we wish to tell others or not.
It seems to me that complaining about the issue gets us nowhere, as this is what is commonly term LIFE, and as such we must learn to live it.
Please accept this as the final word. From here on the moderators will delete if this persists.
Chris Thomas
Peace and Harmony to you all
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Hey Chris,
Would it be OK if the thread got back to its original point of interest?
I'd still love to see pics and info related to the cars for sale even though I will not be bidding.
Can someone please post these or a link to same? :)
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Steve: see the thread started on 31 December, with similar subject http://www.rumcars.org/forum/index.php?topic=4727.msg38017#msg38017
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http://angliacarauctions.co.uk/en/classic-auctions/latest-classic-car-catalogue/saturday-31st-january-2015/a-selection-of-vehicles-from-a-microcar-collection/
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Thanks guys.
I just took the tour.
Good thing that I'm not going, as I might be tempted to remortgage the house for another Scootacar ...no joke! :-\
I guess that identifies me as a true Microaholic.
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I am surprised to see the Scootacars for sale. Mind you he has kept the cream back in his favourite Bond tourer, Zundapp, Schmitt, and Trojan, at least. I am certain only the need to lubricate a change in lifestyle is seeing these cars being sold. As such I would expect a reasonably healthy reserve on some lots, as there are other options open to the vendor. So do not turn up expecting a bargain of lifetime. That said I think they are genuinely for sale and not a few kites being flown.
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Dear me al , with friends like you he doesn't need enemies :D
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OK. Take a long winter journey and go to the sale and pick a total bargain car in a low reserve auction, as the guy is selling stuff off. Its is, utter crap/flippable/underpriced/really good stuff, depending on who you are, and if your buying or selling, of course. Everyone will have a great time, get a total bargain, yet the seller will make more than he dreamed possible. If you wait to the end of the auction some geezer will be knocking out five loaves and a couple of spratts to the same effect, free :o.
I accept you do not care if the seller is to remain an active Microcar enthusiast, as your only interested in his stash. Suffice it to say he has a better car collection than I do, but I will not list what he has in its entirety. Who gives a dumpkin why he is selling, as long as 'I' get my bargain ;).
Is that better? Will that improve the auction experience over pointing out that if you expect these cars below market value, I would not waste time in going? Is a room full of underfunded anoraks going to aid the auction process for serious punters? :P
Personally I am pleased he is keeping some microcars in his collection. At least he actually cherishes them and drives them! He will be sad to see them go. He did not create the collection to make money, this is near 40 years experience and effort to get some good cars together, because he likes them 8).
This is also available in ironed braille on Conqueror hammer embossed paper and on Betemax video (http://).
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Golly there are some very angry and grumpy people on the the forum this New Year :) also some that never notice that a smiley face makes a VERY different meaning for a posting .
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I like that 1926 Chummy.
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Indeed, smilies added.
Ooo eck, the distraction of other machinery. I like the Lotus, but is it genuine? The Elan, likewise.
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I like the small Lotus's too. Wasn't fond of their later output e.g. esprit, eclat etc. The elise was a return to form, although far less practical than an original Elan or Elan+2.
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I see the two Scootacars made over £50,000 between them. :o
Anybody on here bought them?
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Oh, that is pleasing for the seller. I was seriously concerned at the wisdom of timing and a regional sales room.
Seems prices are up. A Goggo saloon with naffed engine looking shiny, but wrong, went for £5,300, so about £5,750 by the time you got home. That is half what I paid for the Bianchina. Cannot be right, or the Bianchina was cheap.
Doubt if I will bother with a Goggo, if that is the price. Nice cars, got all the bits, but the Fiat has a better market place, cheaper spares and is a DHC. Means I can sell a lot of spares stashed away just keeping parts for the two Darts (on that showing £20k cars - I doubt it).
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Oh, that is pleasing for the seller. I was seriously concerned at the wisdom of timing and a regional sales room.
Anglian Auctions were claiming this was the largest classic car auction in the UK with over 300 entries. Attendance was around 3K people !!.
Most Microcars sold at sensible prices and spot on current market trends. Nobel £7K, Bond MkF project £1K, replica P50, not such a good investment at £6.8K, T60 ex. John Lee 3.2K, Scootacar Mk2 21K, Scootacar Mk1 27K all plus commission.
Despite all the discussion here there was little sightings of Forum members, or did I just not see you in the crowd ;D
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Oh, that is pleasing for the seller. I was seriously concerned at the wisdom of timing and a regional sales room.
Despite all the discussion here there was little sightings of Forum members, or did I just not see you in the crowd ;D
did you really attend?!
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I'm amazed at the price of those scootacars. :o
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Al did say there were three auctions at the weekend have we any other results ?
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Messerscmitt KR200, good looking restored car - £18,000. About spot on the money in the UK.
Other results yet to be published.
So its official. Scootacars are worth more than KR200. Who would have believed that 20 years ago? The effect of collecting over active usage.
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Supply and demand eh ;) what price a Gordon now ;D
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A few year ago the guy that sold the yellow one last year? with 3 front lights wanted £10,000 for his.
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Really ?? Blimey I never heard that ! That's the one Nick Taylor bought 18 months ago I wonder what he ended up paying , rude to ask . Where did you hear that Rob ?
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From Roger in Prudhoe, his son is called Gordon, told me years ago on the phone that he was thinking of selling it and hoping for that price. He also owned two Bonds I think.
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Frisky family 3 sold on eBay for £4850. WOW!
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In which regard the wow ? So high or low ? I don't know the going rate :-\
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I am not sure there is one for the more unusual cars. The only thing clear to me is Messerschmitts are loosing their historical 'twice the price' of anything else price 'advantage'. That either means they are becoming a bargain for those who want to drive the cars, now clearly a minority, or other factors are coming into play. It does not help that the two clubs are acting like rabbits in the headlights. Meanwhile traditional Micronauts continue to fade away, undermining the long built up knowledge in depth that sustained the cars through the earlier years. Its becoming a whole new scene, which makes selling even harder to predict with new buyers, who want the cars for different reasons to existing owners. It becomes more like an art form. If you can understand that market, I take my hat off to you.
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Eight cars should have returned £76,000. The Empolini failed to sell despite being near mint. I think it faltered at £1,762. More like £4k worth, I would have thought, as these are meant to be in thing, collectable, like Lambros. Don't really see it myself, but there we are, seems no one there did either.