RUMCars Forum

General Category => Off Topic Lounge => Topic started by: richard on June 04, 2015, 08:24:14 PM

Title: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: richard on June 04, 2015, 08:24:14 PM
https://uk.cars.yahoo.com/news/drivers-unaware-licence-changes-090500762.html
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 05, 2015, 08:04:47 AM
Another fine example of the confusion and havoc caused when bureaucrats and politicians make major changes without thinking about the ramifications.

Like getting rid of the "Tax Disc", it used to be easy for Police, Traffic Wardens, Community Wardens and he Public to spot any car driving or parked on public roads with Tax (and therefore possibly without MOT and Insurance too). I have spoken to Police and Wardens who say that they used to take action if they saw a discless vehicle, but now cannot be bothered to check details of every car they see.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 05, 2015, 08:13:46 AM
I never got the paper part of my licence when I renewed up to a plastic photo card one 2 years ago, does anyone know what I have to do if I want to hire a vehicle?

Similar bureaucratic bumbling has happened with London's Congestion Charge...you used to be able to phone, go on-line, or pay at a newsagents. Now you can only pay on-line or by phone, far less convenient if you are out and about and don't have internet!

Worse, if you want to pay by phone you have to go on-line to register the fact that you want to pay by phone. Phone and on-line also require that you Register car details plus your user name and password and the site NEVER recognises your user name and pass word. When you give new ones it says that you are not the registered user of that vehicle. Cash in a shop was SO quick, easy and convenient, no risk of Internet card fraud, no personal details being traded, no need to find a computer and internet.....

Worst of all, at shops you could pay on the day, the day after, or in advance. On-line you can pay on the day, or for 2 or more days ahead, but NOT for the following day!
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: DaveMiller on June 05, 2015, 08:38:26 AM
The point is that the police and traffic wardens are now able to spend that time doing something else (possibly) more useful.  Why is that bad?

The cars not taxed will be picked up, effortlessly, when they pass a number-plate recognition camera.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: super-se7en (Malc Dudley) on June 18, 2015, 09:16:33 PM
Just came back off holiday and had to fly into London. I had booked a hire car back in February to get me back into the Midlands.
They decided i needed a code from the DVLA so they could check if i had any points on my licence. Apparently this code only lasts 72 hours and as i have not been near a computer for 7 days i was stuffed.
They said no problem give me your national insurance number and we will get one. Now i have been retired for 7 years and the last thing i carry around is that number. They said sorry although you have paid and fast tracked the paperwork no hire car.
Well i had been up since 5am and i let them have it with both barrels. The manager appeared, got me to sign a piece of paper and i was on my way. My wife had to throw me some raw meat to calm me down.
The morel of this story is do not leave home without your national insurance number. (If this is progress i am a monkeys uncle.
Rant over i will get my coat.













9
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 18, 2015, 09:34:12 PM
Big Brother gets larger
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: richard on June 18, 2015, 09:39:02 PM
I am sure it is cock up rather than conspiracy but I thought this was something we were going to have to bare in mind   :P
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Mark Green on June 18, 2015, 09:55:53 PM
Wow what will I need in September to rent a car?
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 18, 2015, 11:37:11 PM
I am sure it is cock up rather than conspiracy but I thought this was something we were going to have to bare in mind   :P

Maybe be so. But what when its really important. Like banning free Oxygen 12 hours before issuing respirators. I am sorry. We pay f'ing fortunes in taxation to the State. I expect a professionally acceptable standard of output for that money demanded. A private company would not be allowed to get away with such sloppy work, and has to ask for payment, rather than demand it with menaces. The country should be up in arms over this, and other, 'unforeseen problems'. The fact it is not, is why they occur.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 19, 2015, 07:53:25 AM
I was already aware of this, and it also has implications for holiday makers trying to hire cars in That Foreign.

It is a classic case of British Bean-Counting Bureaucratic Managerial Buffle-headed Dandipratishness.

British bureaucracy is now about the worst in the world, growing out of control, more offices being built everywhere to house the growing population of Buffle-headed Dandiprats, who have little clue of what they do, believe they are God's gift to the planet, and mess up everything they do. They have overseen the mass destruction of our industrial and production base in favour of a "Service Economy".

They have now decided to save the cost of a SINGLE PIECE OF PAPER for a licence that drivers actually pay good money for anyway. Instead of charging us an extra 0.1p for the cost of this single piece of paper, they decide to ditch it without THINKING OF THE CONSEQUENCES AND RAMIFICATIONS of NOT having this paper, and NOT putting it on a Chip on the licence.

The DVLA site keeps crashing due to exceptionally heavy demand, and their Phone Minions are trying desperately to answer questions while Tech Minions try to find an eSolution to this cancelled One Piece Of Paper.

It is costing FAR more than the savings from NOT continuing with One Piece Of Paper.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 19, 2015, 08:23:26 AM
It all stems from the failure to slip the driving licence in as a sort of ID card (eroding our civil liberty. In the main threatened by other inefficient Gov departments, and idiotic European interference, that should have remained unimplemented). More effort was put into this ID element, than its actual use as a driving licence. In fact they have scrapped the wrong thing, as the bit of paper was the driving licence. To do anything to do with driving meant having the bit of paper, or an old licence like I did until I moved, save many companies chose not to accept these as they did not have ID pictures on them. So they were complicit in the deceit now biting everyone on the bum.
 
The reality is authorities that need to ID drivers now only need the picture on file, as they can compare the image held with what is in front of them, by using there various gadgets. So the ID card part of the licence is not actually needed, but the paper bit is. But having got part way to an ID card you can bet the State will not give that up. So await the answer......A more complicated card, with more info on it, more like an ID card, for a higher fee. Which is what they want, but will not get by asking. That in itself will be a mess-up and another half million immigrants will fiddle that system to become British and claim all sorts of rights at the populations expence.

But the important thing is that people in charge, are in charge. Beware of anyone who is importantly in charge, is my advice. They tend to be dangerous, or idiotic, normally both. 
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: super-se7en (Malc Dudley) on June 19, 2015, 09:40:23 AM
Regarding Marks post.
I believe it only applies to those of us who own a British driving licence.All other nationalities (i think) get away with it. I do love our country.
Why do we always form a queue.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 19, 2015, 11:14:35 AM
Its easier to get into the UK without a passport, than with an out of date passport! We are second class citizens in our own country. Still better than most places to live though.

Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: DaveMiller on June 19, 2015, 11:22:57 AM
They have now decided to save the cost of a SINGLE PIECE OF PAPER for a licence that drivers actually pay good money for anyway. Instead of charging us an extra 0.1p for the cost of this single piece of paper

Mmmm.  A single piece of non-standard, thick and durable paper, bought in huge quantities, is likely to cost rather more, but then there's the printing, the post, the systems to do those things, the people to run those systems, the people to design those systems, the people to organise those people ...

I'm sure there will be savings, but surely the point of the changeover is that the computer record will be more up to date than an old piece of paper.

The part of the changeover which I find deplorable, though, is the almost covert implementation.  I'm reasonably well read, I like to think, and anything car-related tends to catch my eye, but it's only recently, and through indirect sources such as this forum, that I've learned of it.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 19, 2015, 11:33:40 AM
Dave, I was exaggerating somewhat for comic effect, but the change was not well thought out, and certainly extremely poorly notified!
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 22, 2015, 12:42:42 PM
As I am going on holiday next month, and sharing driving duties in a mini bus, I have had to get my details from here:

https://www.viewdrivingrecord.service.gov.uk/driving-record/licence-number

You have to provide Licence number, NI number and post code, then you get a check code to see/share/print out your licence details.

I was lucky because the site was working well today, but it has been crashing almost constantly, apparently.

For the 3 of us driving that means that :



Each of us has to go on-line to do this (time + electricity for computers and printers)

TWELVE (12) sheets of paper have to be printed out (ink + paper + electricity)

and sent (envelope + stamp + Mail time + fuel to deliver)

to the hire company, in advance.

EDIT: the site kept refusing to accept my licence number as valid, after many attempts I finally realised that you have to omit the last two digits of your number!
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 22, 2015, 04:35:14 PM
It works. The State saved money, you did not. Welcome to the world of stealth tax.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 22, 2015, 04:43:07 PM
Er, the state had to open and design a new website, and continues to have to deal with many Overload Crashes, as well as receiving countless phone calls, emails and letters form the public. IT and clerical time must have cost a fortune!
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 22, 2015, 04:52:05 PM
Yeah, but that is OK, as your paying for it, and someone is in charge. Terribly important that somebody is in charge. More important than anything working.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 22, 2015, 04:54:55 PM
Yup!
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: AndrewG on June 22, 2015, 11:18:16 PM
Yes, the admin dragon (an accurate technical term) of the hire company I am using says she wants me to arrive with a printed page of the check code since she cannot rely on my handwriting.  It's just as well I'm a customer and she has to be so polite, I think.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 23, 2015, 07:47:43 AM
The Check Code is only valid for a few days after which you have to re-register. When you do register and view, there are four pages, at least one of which seems to me to be not something any hire company would "need" to see or keep on file. However, I have learned that pieces of paper are ALL vitally important to those whose job involves pieces of paper, therefore I prinetd ALL of mine, and will print ALL of my brother's ones when I register his licence today. Both of us will also sign and date each piece of paper and confirm that neither of us has any charges or prosecutions pending.

Leave no room for the beggars to say "Ah, but you haven't........" !
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: super-se7en (Malc Dudley) on June 23, 2015, 09:29:40 AM
The most important piece of information in the new system is your national insurance number as the hire company can apply for a code (with your permission) at the point of collection. Do not leave home without it. Mine is tattooed on my backside so i can show any official when required.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 23, 2015, 10:12:55 AM
Yup, licence number (minus last two digits!), NI number and Post Code  needed.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 23, 2015, 08:32:32 PM
NI number is your State number and if you were a cow, would be clipped to your ear on a plastic label. Prime beef or milking herd?
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 24, 2015, 07:24:25 AM
Luckily I am not a silly old moo!
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 24, 2015, 11:40:55 AM
I have done my brother's one now (he cannot/does not use computers).

Worth noting that my Licence number ends with a space then two more digits. On bro's the two digits were on the line below, so if yours is like mine try leaving off the last two digits or you will waste 30 mins like I did! Obviously advising us of this is far to much to ask of them!
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 24, 2015, 03:53:53 PM
I was going to ask what you do without a computer, etc. Big assumptions going on.
Still soon if your off the computer/mobile networks, you will not exist and have no bank account. If you take my tip you jetison all but the amount of Currancy needed in favour of real money. It will then be impossible for the Government to afford to find you and to extract its protection racket funds. Sounds good to me. Buffalo roam free.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: richard on June 24, 2015, 04:11:09 PM
Ah Al. I only wish that I was as fit as you and not in need of the NHS . I suppose you would go to a private doctor with a bag , large , of cash . You do like to pick and choose which bits of society to belong too  :)
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 24, 2015, 07:22:18 PM
Ah, if its supporting you the system is a wonderful thing. Need a computer to work out when that happens, Doh!
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: richard on June 24, 2015, 07:25:26 PM
 :)
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Chris Thomas on June 26, 2015, 04:57:54 PM
Dear All

I have just returned from a business trip to Ireland where I needed a hire car to get to a remote location reminisant of  Craggy Island (Terminfeckin), and remembered to download and print off my driving licence documentation. It was good to have an official document that said in big letters    Offences Zero, points Zero

The Irish car hire man was slightly surprised that I had it, so it would seem that not everybody remembers. I still had to show my credit card driving licence as well. Perhaps they should include our mug shots on these new paper documents, or would that be a security risk!!!

I found the system worked well provided you had a colour printer and a computer. As you say god help you if you have not.

Chris Thomas
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 26, 2015, 07:42:17 PM
Craggy Island eh?

Giiirls! Drrrrink! Arrrse!

"Father Ted, will we walk over to the gate now?"
"No Dougal, I think we've had enough fun for one day"'

"Alright Dougal, let's try it one more time: this cows.... SMALL, those cows......FAR AWAY"

Love it!
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Chris Thomas on June 26, 2015, 09:18:29 PM
A friend of mine is a music teacher and was teaching in a big Catholic school where there were a lot of nuns on the teaching staff and one or two priests who floated in and out.

One day somebody in the staff room was talking about Father Ted, and some passing nuns overheard and stopped to listen. My friend asked "Have you ever seen Father Ted on the TV" to which they replied that yes they never miss it. My friend explained that he was surprised that they never missed it and what was it that they liked about that particular program, to which they replied "We LOVE Father Ted and the stories are so realistic".

Chris Thomas
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: AndrewG on June 26, 2015, 09:23:16 PM
So, accessing the DVLA site to practice for an upcoming hire, I looked at the other info - and was disappointed to find I have only a provisional licence for road rollers.  That's going to limit my employment prospects...
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: richard on June 26, 2015, 11:40:09 PM
Glad I posted this one , it's certainly got legs  :)
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 26, 2015, 11:58:24 PM
Only if you have a licence to walk on them.

Funny we were discussing this only tonight. Old fogey rights, if you applied before time, out of certain vehicle groups, to retain rights otherwise lost. Means you cannot drive a Forklift, tracked vehicle and a road roller. They are across the board new tests for these. But you could have retained Bus, unloaded of paying passengers or with a number , 6?, nonepaying passingers. Not to be confused with Minibuses. Unloaded locomotives with trailer up to 12 tons. Think its the same with unladen buses to a total of 12 tons. Van and trailer where the load is up to 71/2 ton rules, effectively your in the goods vehicle territory which most folk need another test for. This last one catches out quite a few campervan folk, as well.
 I kept up all my rights so other than the three first ones and the HGV classes I can drive the lot. Many micronauts ought to be the same, but only if you claimed your rights at the time.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: marcus on June 27, 2015, 07:19:59 AM
The oddest vehicle I have driven on public roads is my Drum Car but the licence categories do not seem to have it listed.

As for Ted, I know a musician and writer who married an Irish woman and moved over there and after a couple of years said that longer he lived there the more Father Ted seemed like a "fly-on-the-wall" documentary! I love the place.
Title: Re: driving licence changes - did you know ?
Post by: Big Al on June 27, 2015, 07:56:32 PM
Its a bet beat up now, Marcus. Is it for a digger?