RUMCars Forum

General Category => Invalid Carriages & other related conveyances => Topic started by: Big Al on March 13, 2016, 08:34:20 AM

Title: ICR news
Post by: Big Al on March 13, 2016, 08:34:20 AM

The negotiations have been going on behind the scenes. All looks rosy now and a date is being set up for a meeting in April, probably, where the hand over might occur. It seeks to unite the main interested parties into one resource, each part continuing to achieve its function, or skill set, without to much duplication of effort. All have something to bring to the table, and all together a still fledgling interest can bat above its weight. RUM, Barry, Scott and Ian will hopefully be appraised of things in time, as all have shown interest in helping in there own ways.

Stuart himself is more motivated, as he can see his work can bare fruit, and the space be created where he can input his skill set without being pressurised beyond that which he can cope with during, what might be, a tough part of life. He was back to his chortling self the other day, good to see.
Once we have the hand over sorted out, I can back down as a sort of arbitrary soundboard to help Stuart, and concentrate on attempting to identify who has what spares. There is talk of the ICR holding spares, as there is a clear overstock of some items nullifying there current value. Things that will only have value in 25 years time, after most of us will either be in an IC or driving a cloud. Experience with Microcar clubs shows such forward spares seizure as beyond value. As it is we have missed several caches to the scrap man.


Thursday was spent collection 2 Mk12E Invacar and some 11/2 tons of spare parts. A big day as we had grant to search through a small barn full of stuff looking for IC related items. Took a bit of time and not all could be loaded on top of the three engines already removed from the reducing pile of those. There will be another two trip like this next week probably, and that will brake the back of the task started back in December! Certainly look to be on track for 40 engines, 55 dynostarters and 6 cars plus goodness knows what else.
But also there are non micro things of interest, like a huge dome - to make an observatory in my garden? A large quantity of Swedish ships pitch, now negotiated into ownership, and a Fiat car. Stuart has found about a quarter of a Peel in parts from other machines, so if a Peel is really worth £50k he has probably got £10k of bits! Sadly the world does not work like that. Not that he cares, its Peel and looks good on his shelves.

The tubs of loose parts have come inside, during one of the BUMS get togethers last Saturday night. We started by looking at Eccles' scrounging from beyond Chelmsford. I bought the remains of a stamp collection off him.

We then emptied each tub on the table to see what we had, quickly sorting. Good few light units, mirrors and shiny bits that folk like. A lot of Villiers carbs, sadly most without their insides. Used regulators and starter relays to service. Various new parts, stuff from electric IC. While patchy it is a goodly selection with more to come. There are a quantity of dash boards to part up, as the plastic is broken.
We found some specialist IC equipment that is rarely seen, These parts were to adapt the cars to peculiar disablement. Should cars come up with these less usual controls they represent vehicles to document and track, as they may well now be one offs.

With respect to the two Mk12 bought home. These are in a very much more sound condition than the Trysul cars. They needed far less work to get them rolling and look like pretty simple restorations. The Mk12 might not have the power of the Type 70, but it makes up for it with a perhaps more pleasing style, and for being smaller, thus easier to fit in a collection. 3 of these require new homes and I believe we have one interested party already. So I would register interest early, so as not to be disappointed. This is the last certain cache of cars we know about not in the ICRs knowledge, though there are leads to several more addresses that might yield something. The fun of following up on them is, as its early days, you do not know what you might find. A couple of bits or a mothballed workshop. Anything is possible.
Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Big Al on March 17, 2016, 11:12:30 AM
Such is the continual finds clearing out the property of IC related parts that we had to leave a complete next load ready to be collected with a 16 ft trailer and loaded Trooper. The intention was to return today to pick up that ready to move stuff, but such was the loading the trailerr suffered a failure. It will take a few days to be restored to serviceability. WE can then do the next run. There are at least two more runs to do with the box trailer. Now I have an extra run up to remove stuff for friends taking Fiat, and smallholding machinery equipment.

Finds last trip included a set of Scootacar lights, complete, some NOS. Few Schmitt parts. A good box of spare light units for IC. Three AC diffs and two Tippen rear ends. A good haul of differing mirrors. So it goes on. Thoroughly enjoying myself!
Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Big Al on March 20, 2016, 11:27:33 AM
Taking the time to sort out the spares collected so far, the mountain has reduced a little, as scrap, and defective parts, have been removed, and odd bits given, or supplied to, those waiting for specific parts. I can once again move round my lounge.

As an example of the amount of parts obtained so far the light units were cleaned up a little and boxed up during the Rugby Internationals. There exists over a £1,000 worth of stock here alone. Admittedly not all this will sell off in the next few years, so some of that will probably become ICR property and stock into the future. This was always the vision of how to treat the spares, the needs of IC in the future, and the repayment of the person funding the purchase of the parts to facilitate that the free and excess spares to go into the ICR. Everyone wins, not just the initial buyer making an excess profit.

Today I have spare wheels to store away. Wiring looms to check and ID. Some 20 dash boards to strip of components, plus completing the unbroken dashboards sets, so that there is a possibility of whole, or partial replacement. The ABS material is quite brittle after 40 years. Seatbelts are sorted and condense so well I might take the rest on offer. I now have the parts missing on my late Type 70's dashboard making that car complete. The restoration going on with Frazer's car encourages me to do this car to a higher standard. It has the potential to be one of the best examples. Stuart even his some history on this car's previous owners via his records. I wonder if any will still be alive and well enough to see their old car reborn, it would be a great reunion story.

Stuart, meanwhile, has inspected the cars, identified them and recorded their details. In several cases he has now identified the actual original number from his archive system,. All 6 cars should become registered with DVLA on original, or age related plates, thus making the sale of each car that more attractive to a restorer. With the amount of spares to draw on I am confident the Mk12E cars will be 99% complete cars, so pretty easy to restore. The Type 70 is a little more of a challenge having had its body cut about a bit. Such is demand, and rarity, I can see the right billet coming in for it, though it is tempting to sort it myself.

We are cooking on gas down here. A garden shed has been scrounged to be IC Spares, possibly ICR Spares if needs be. Filling cabinets and shelving all coming free from the clearances. All of which will mean virtual nil storage costs.

Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Big Al on March 29, 2016, 10:29:55 AM
Thursday, another trip up. This was a tidy up mission before venturing into new unexplored territory. The box trailer had the Brott Stuart liberated put into it. Despite worries it fitted rather well, and simply. It weighs 61/2 cwt complete, so we had about 6 cwt of it. Turns out this one has most of the extras on it, like electric start, so it was a bit of a bargain. The trailer was then top dressed with light bits and bobs, much ear marked for Ian Hellings. One item stood out , a oval tube frame with two large thing wheels in the centre, along with a seat. One end had a sort of stabilising bracket, the other the remains of a small jokey wheel. A childs scooter of sorts, a sort of Child's Velorex. Try pics on it later.

The Trooper was filled with prior left stack of wheels and spares. On top of that we had the gleanings of the shed we expected to unpack, including two more dynostarters to add to the pile. It had already been done. Then it was out with the prodding tools to find items submerged in the soil over the period of the clear-out. This yealded a surprising amount of good stuff. A galvanised dustbin full of misc small bits was put in to. Probably little in there, but you have to look through it. Just as it looked like we were winning another shed was found loaded with more IC spares. Looks like a load in itself. Streuth.

Despite it being BH Thurs the run back was good and I got home to feed the dogs at 7.00 pm. This morning I unloaded. Andrew came round so we cleaned up the Type 70 and a Mk12. The Type 70 refused to work. An electrical failure in the primary wiring, evidence of a melted wire. Oh dear. But not to hard to resolve as that part of the loom is repeated a lot of times in the s/h spares. Plan is to offer it running, so its a known quantity, save for the body issues. Again pics soon, you will have a laugh, I think.

Andrew unpacked his sunroofs. He is ready to collect the roofless Fiat Cinquacento Soleil now, so that is the next target, if we can solve the lack of a key to loosen the steering lock. Failing that there are the last two IC to come back. The Trooper can be filled again.

Then a few days on

Another Trooper full, but with an Allen (Badge imported International)Triple Mower in the trailer this time. However this was the contents of the uninspected shed. Lots of new parts like carbs, inlets, drives. fuel mount kits, wiper motors, load of Villiers bits including Barrel kits, clutch and dynostarters. 3 more Scootacar headlights. So actually a very good haul.
We also got the Fiat keys sorted out, the car will now run and steer. Absolute bargain as the keys were free. The lack of keys had driven the selling price to nil too. So a free 45k Fiat Soleil, one of 12 left!
Blooming knackered, but a good days work.

Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Big Al on April 23, 2016, 08:25:55 AM
Our 8th trip up was completed last week. There have been quite a few pleasant surprises and much generosity from the owner in allowing us to take associated parts, and even a whole Allen triple mower, and nigh on 80 gallons of Swedish Pitch for caulking (traditional boats, houses and windmills, and as rare as creosote these days. That will stop my Schmitt rusting!). Stocks of certain Peel and Scootacar parts reach oversupply and in due time a few bits will probably end up on the market.
That this has turned into a bigger job than expected is no great stress fortunately. The owner has had the benefit of our sifting through stuff, pulling out valuable non IC parts too. So rather than pay to sling the lot, he has gained some good stock to sell, while we shift a great deal of otherwise what would be rubbish to him. This meant a succession of finds, like a chicken house full of new stock, including Villiers/Siba. Even this last trip found Root in the far corner flipping over a few sheets of roofing extrusion to find a huge pile of misc parts. I must say my heart sank a little, but not for long. So this was picked through partially, filling two tubs twice the size of bathtubs. The prizes being another Schmitt ignition switch, two Scootacar indicator units, Villiers clutch plates and script badges. So at least two more trips to do.

To give some idea of scale of work the picture shows 74 of the now 82 dynostarters recovered for reconditioning. Some of those belong to the 46 engines also recovered, that is nearly one spare engine for every Type 70 left. However the units have use beyond that, as do the dynostarters. Not only that but I have stocks of new plugs, points and so on with which to do it. That will save some £15 an engine, or if 40 engines are good, £600! My house looks like an IC dealers with parts everywhere. Some sorting has condensed things by identifying damaged stock and removing parts from sub-assemblies like broken dashboards. I have done about 30 so far. I am still enjoying doing all this, it ever was my favourite thing, sorting out nuggets from other folks trash.


It is a pity we do not really know what the other lots of spares consist off. I think there is a chance that Barry's stuff might dovetail into the stuff here, as I suspect he has a bias of stock, much new, away from the engines, which the company were using in their Haflinger business. Some of the stock will be those obscure brackets and grommets that no one values, until you need one. So I should not pull his leg to much. Once the ICR has re adjusted maybe something can be done, though either way having Barry on board will be a boon, as he is at least a great ambassador for the cars. We need to be all pointing in the same direction, if we can. I wonder if after reaching nil stock, the ICR can then look to sell off its inherited raft of stock so the next raft of sales income is used to buy Barry out, rendering that stock to nil value too, for instance. If its fair for me, it is for him. No one has made a loss.
Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Big Al on May 26, 2016, 09:15:34 AM
I can finally announce, after the 11th and final trip up, that the Oddingley clearances are at an end. Indeed I can even say it is from Oddingley, Worcestershire, that all this stuff came. Many will be aware of a garden full of twonk, including microcars, round there. Well its gone and the property sold last night. The last two trips involved little IC related items, though an engine, a few misplaced new parts, and such, were included. The main task turned to removing a large quantity of roofing panels sufficient to cover a 70 ft by 16 ft shed I am looking at putting up in the back of my garden. Its come at a deal such that I have saved a humongous amount on buying in materials. In addition there are galvinised panels enough to re roof all the wooden sheds, dispensing with the tedious need to maintain felt roofing after each winters gales, and to put the end on the free edge of the new shed.

On the top of the first load we put the gable ends of the Ministry Garages we saved. A perfect topping to a tottery load. I am happy to put up the small one, 6 ft wide, in my garden, as it will house a Type 70, or perhaps the road going Schmitt to eventually be created. I just like the idea of my old car having a period home to live in. The other might become part of a Museum display. Again humble stuff, no real value, but mostly scrapped and out of mind. Worth keeping a few, just as it creates interest. Its why I wanted a large garden area.

The bonus item has been to secure the old Radome made in Melbourne, circa 1974. It is 7ft odd in diameter and sadly has an area of damage. But that will be lost in its new life as the top of my astronomical observatory, to go in the garden. This rode home proudly on the second trip, atop more roofing. We got some very odd looks on the M5.

The whole 7 month task has been an adventure of discovery. Like a private autojumble. I am greatly enriched with stuff, other folks have gained, and the ICR has benefited greatly. So many positives.

In a timely accident of dates the ICR meeting happens today. So that should see the active passing on of the ICR into new management. The old management will remain as the repository of good information. Somehow the spares will be connected. It should move on to a different form of presentation. We will see. After the talking, we plan to have a pub meal. I need the rest after three days of loading and unloading huge quantities of crap. Come the weekend, hopefully we can move some round the back and clear my driveway.

Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Rob Dobie on May 26, 2016, 12:02:44 PM
You are still having a lot of fun then Al.

Radome ----- That's where I am living now.  :D

My initials are RAD and my house is my 'ome.

OK I'll go away now!
Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Daniel Rodd on May 26, 2016, 01:49:47 PM
Big Al, i have been following this with interest,what i didnt realise till today was where this has come from.The chap who lived at the school house in Oddingley was a close friend of my grandfathers,and also a work colleague when they both worked for Ashley Repairs in Worcester,the Worcestershire Ministry garage for invalid carriages.In fact it was me who told Stuart about them what must be 15 years ago now!
I am so,so glad that all this stuff has been saved (not that i realised there was so much,but he did work there for a good many years with my grandad) I had often though that being he was in advancing years the likely hood would be that one day i would go past and find the lot flattened and cleared,and all the artifacts and IC stuff lost forever.
If there was any paperwork etc from Ashley Repairs i would be most grateful to see it or perhaps have a copy as the whole place and story has great sentimental interest to me,My grandad being where a lot of my engineering and vehicular interests come from,and of course Invalid Carriages!

Top Work!
Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Big Al on May 28, 2016, 10:03:11 AM
Sadly, while there were cars, new spares and second hand spares, there was no paperwork to speak of. Not even handbooks. Either that or it was in the organic mulch that was burned, as much that was friable had decomposed.

Not sure why he ended up with much of this stuff. But at one point it was possible to buy unwanted IC for a £1 each to scrap. Quite why this ran to 46 engines I do not know, but Ashley had ended up collecting cars from across the country. The fact is that there was a chance for those in the right position to make a bit extra on the side. We will never know.

We were tipped off initially that there were IC for sale by a Bond Owners Club representative. It was only on visiting that it become apparent that the initial contact had been to find Russell Church, of the Messerschmitt Owners Club, with whom the guys had dealt with before. The MOC chose not to pass this information to Russ, and one of their representatives turned up and cherry picked the regulators, black boxes and 10 of the Type 70 dynostarters, as they can be converted to Tiger units.
Neither Russ, or the ICR received info about this, which is pretty much par for the course. It was left to BOC to do the right thing, which they did on being offered the remains of the IC. So they will be receiving a finders fee of £250 in due course, as they could have nabbed 5 dead engines and kept quite. (The other fee was taken as a machine) The MOC, well in their greed they left 83 further dynostarters behind, probably assuming they would get scrapped, protecting their market. The have annoyed Russ further, as it was his lead, (he would have then told me, as we are buddys). The Schmitters prove that they are lightweights again. Bonds one, Schmitts nil. (a small, but causal reason among others, that its time to sell my Schmitts off. Nice cars, shame about the owners).

Its unfortunate, but my experience has made me keep these clearance locations private info. I have had to many instances of seeing things I have bought heading in the opposite direction down the road on someone else's trailer. Groombridge being a class case. Its better to restrict the information, reward those who play the game, and kick those who do not into touch. Funny how I get to know about these clearances, isn't it? Its fair shares to those who get involved, as long as I can create a timely budget I can afford. I have always treated to obtain what was left over by the finder. So its in their interests to deal with the big guy. That said I suspect this will be the last big clearance I make, as what chance is there of any further places being left, in an area I can reasonably access. I have really enjoyed doing this one, as always. Its what I really like doing, and I am good at it, I think.
Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Daniel Rodd on May 28, 2016, 10:27:48 AM
Sad for me as I'm going to have to visit my grandad to let him know his old friend has died,the ford consul my dad sold the owner in 1980,still there all these years later.He was one of the last of the Dibnah types,eccentric, obsessed with mechanical things,and wouldn't see anything scrapped.I will see if I can find out more about how some of the stuff came to be there,but my grandad left Ashley's after he broke his neck in an accident,towing a broken down Invacar behind a Bedford HA van.This would have been late 60s early 70s,so would predate model 70 era.They stayed friends ever since,though since my grandad moved from Worcester to Evesham probably hadn't seen him for a good few years. I met the owner a few times at farm auctions asnd the like,buying all sorts of stuff.
The ministry garages sound fascinating, iim assuming these are the DHSS supplied jobs that were provided for users? My grandad used to put them up! One tale being he had to go to Birmingham to lower the Yale lock on the door for the shortest woman in Britain (at the time) who drove a Barrett Midget.
Quite fitting that the first stash if IC I told Stuart about when he took over the ICR,should be the last to be saved as he hands over the reigns :-)
Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Big Al on May 28, 2016, 11:12:50 AM
It does rather underline Root's tenure as ICR man. But in the doing, it gives it a better future as we have some spares, as will as the archive access. 15 years is a long time to head up something. I am hopeful that we will see the ICR move in a different direction. We had vidio taken of us, and threats of being published. Simon is into technology.

The Ministry Garages were issued to those in need. They are basic angle iron and asbestos panel jobs. Many of the agents got the nod to put them up. Its a pretty valueless thing, but it is history, much like an Anderson shelter before it.

Root documented your old Ford in pictures, I believe. It was to far gone to be restored, It might have been the one with a tree grown round it. Though some of its vitals live on as spares resources to others of its kin.
Title: Re: ICR news
Post by: Daniel Rodd on May 28, 2016, 12:14:40 PM
I really should see with stupot if there is some way I can help with the ICR,I have had a long interest in them and their importance in social and motoring history.
I'm hoping to see my grandad over the weekend,I might be able to glean more info on this interesting  story.