Author Topic: KR200 hydraulic brakes?  (Read 8329 times)

Bob Purton

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KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« on: January 20, 2008, 07:41:14 PM »
I have found several references on the internet to a non factory eight inch hydraulic brakes conversion kit marketed in Britain for KR200's. Does anyone know anything about this?

g-o-g-g-o

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2008, 09:27:27 PM »
I have a copy of an article on converting messerschmitt brakes to hydraulic - I'ts dated october 6th 1960 out of Motor Cylcling - it says tha a firm named J W Perkins of 130 pinner road Harrow (over your way?) have a kit of parts - I imagine there are long since gone out of business but I'll copy the article if you want me to.

Bob Purton

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2008, 10:07:00 PM »
Thanks Mike. A copy would be much appreciated. I have for some time now wanted to develop my own hydraulic braking system for a schmitt but unlike the common one that uses ten inch mini wheels I still wanted to keep the eight inch wheels so that the conversion would be invisible. I tryed to think of other cars that had eight inch wheels and hydraulics but could only think of scootacars and Inters and using these parts is a none started due to there rarity. Does anyone know of any other cars that fit the bill with readily available parts? What about some of the French sans permis cars?
« Last Edit: January 20, 2008, 10:09:36 PM by bobbybubble »

Stuart Cyphus

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2008, 10:56:28 PM »
? What about some of the French sans permis cars?

 EEK!!!  Keep away, keep away!!! Mind you, my Mini-Comtesse does indeed have 8 inch wheels, but the brakes are operated by rod (no, not you Daniel, you've got too many "d"'s... ::)), however the later 1980s versions have hydrulics. Only problem is, they're actully rarer than a Scootacar over here!!!!!!   :o
« Last Edit: January 20, 2008, 10:59:34 PM by Stuart Cyphus »

Chris Thomas

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2008, 09:36:16 AM »
Dear Bobby Bubble

If you look at the modern day French San Permis vehicles they have some very small disc brakes on the front and rear wheel because they are very light, and whilst the wheels are bigger I would expect that they may fit inside of a smaller wheel. Also look at mountain bike and trials bikes, which use some very small and light weight disc brakes that are very powerful.

Some of the small disc brake systems are cable operated and could perhaps be more easily addapted to the KR200.

Chris T

Bob Purton

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2008, 10:47:52 AM »
Dont panic Stuart, your comtesse is safe! I'm not about to wreck a car for its brakes, thats why I bought up spares availability. Chris, thanks for your suggestions. I own a Virgo and have looked at the disc's but this option throws up more problems, i.e. no where to anchor the calipers without welding lumps onto the suspension arm and thats a no no, I'm only prepared to do such a conversion if it can be reversed with no or little damage, the whole hub/disc arrangement is wider causing wheels to foul the wings, plus the fact that the brakes are not great to start with [week and prone to siezing]. Cable operated calipers are not what I wanted, the whole idea is to eliminate the constant adjustments needed with cable systems, thats why I have concluded that a small drum hydraulic system is the best idea. I still think the answer is in France and Stuart may have given me the solution. Any more ideas anyone?
« Last Edit: January 21, 2008, 11:01:16 AM by bobbybubble »

P50

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2008, 01:05:07 PM »
How about Ligier JS4 brakes?
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Bob Purton

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2008, 01:20:43 PM »
Well JS4 wheels look to be eight inch although rather fat, are they hydraulic? I know they work well enough because I had a go of Nicks in the summer at Jeans. Nick has moved his on I think. Does anyone have one I could take a look at or anything else that fits the bill? Is this something that you might consider for yours P50 or is it sacreligious? There is another alternative and thats to build some up from scratch to my own design, its quite feasable because I have already done it for the Inter, when I bought it both of the whole wheel hub/drum plus brakes backplate assemblies were missing. I borrowed one from a pal in France and had castings done from it, machined them up, made the shoes and used Renault 4cv slave cylinders. To look at them you would never know but for the fact that I have just told the world and his dog! The down side is that it cost about £500!
« Last Edit: January 21, 2008, 01:34:25 PM by bobbybubble »

P50

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2008, 04:04:22 PM »
Whilst I find the whole Schmitt braking system agricultural to say the least and tiresome to keep in A1 spec I think it's part of the car and thus should remain. You can lock the wheels of a KR on cables so I've learnt to live with the constant adjustment and moving of the lever one notch.

JS4 brakes are hydraulic 8" drums. Flexi pipes go from each cylinder to the master. There are no steel pipes.  The master would fit a treat in the nose of a KR. The drums are narrow and petite although the wheels are very chunky.  Trouble is JS4's and 6's are rocking horse excreta these days...       

"Men of worth act like men of worth, and men of genius, who produce
things beautiful and excellent, shine forth far better when other people
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Bob Purton

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2008, 04:18:42 PM »
Thanks P50. Now who has the parts I need to try it?

P50

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2008, 05:00:16 PM »
EBAY France watch list and see what comes through...
"Men of worth act like men of worth, and men of genius, who produce
things beautiful and excellent, shine forth far better when other people
praise them than when they boast so confidently of their own achievements."
-Benvenuto Cellini

bubblenuts

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2008, 06:03:34 PM »
The brake cylinders for Scootacars are same as morris minor and all parts still readily available and the Scootacar Lockheed 3/4" master cylinder is also still available (part 95415)  from PowerTrack Ltd in Windsor. Hope this helps.

Bob Purton

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2008, 06:35:28 PM »
Thanks bubblenuts, Am I correct in thinking that the drums and backplates are morris minor rear? Do you know what the wheels were from because they are completely different to the kr200?

P50

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2008, 06:50:34 PM »
Scootacars have a only 3 nuts holding on the wheels.

Unique, bespoke,unsuitable for your conversion and impossible to obtain anyway!
"Men of worth act like men of worth, and men of genius, who produce
things beautiful and excellent, shine forth far better when other people
praise them than when they boast so confidently of their own achievements."
-Benvenuto Cellini

Bob Purton

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Re: KR200 hydraulic brakes?
« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2008, 06:58:31 PM »
Where there's a wheel there's a way! Ha Ha!!
« Last Edit: January 21, 2008, 07:07:05 PM by bobbybubble »