Author Topic: Heinkel hand brake bracket?  (Read 6112 times)

adi

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Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« on: April 16, 2010, 11:10:28 PM »
Well, now i actually got stuck into this little miserable car, it doesnt seem THAT bad anymore. I knew i should have walked away from it, its a heap of rust, but hey no point complaining about whats already happened etc. I guess im stuck with it now. At least it aint a scootacar.

There is this mythical components of a Heinkel where the hand brake lives. I have never seen one, and the one on mine is just plain missing.

From what i heard/seen/imagined, a Heinkel hand brake is much like a normal car hand brake, and it needs a horizontal surface with a square hole to mount to. Right? In the diagram i just drew it as a black box, as my art skills arnt good enough to draw a hand brake facing head-on.

As far as i know, the bracket thing that holds it on looks something like this



Just a 90 degree section of metal joining the wall and the floor, with a hole for the hand brake to mount to.

But, having never seen one myself, its kind of hard to imagine. What if its a triangular cross section, and both the top and bottom mount to the wall, like this:



Or it could be something completely different entirely.

Can anyone who has a Heinkel kindly take a picture of the hand brake bracket, so i can see how its constructed, and where/how its mounted in relation to other components?

Thanks!

marcus

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2010, 08:17:04 AM »
Having been through exactly the same questions and processes myself I think the best thing you can do right now is follow the advice that G-o-g-g-o game me: order a Parts List book and workshop manual from the Heinkel Trojan Club. The parts list has drawings ("Exploded Diagrams") which show how all the small parts fit together to make, for instance, the handbrake assembly. These two books are essential for anyone restoring a Heinkel or Trojan, unless they have a VERY good knowledge of the cars, and believe me I had no knowledge of them when I started, and I did not understand why G-o-g-g-o was so insistent on me getting the parts list......until I did!
Most Heinkels and early Trojans have a long horizontal internal"sill" running along the side of the car which forms part of the hand brake bracket assembly. My Trojan does not have this, mine is a "floor plate" with 2 upright plates and the brake lever and clutch mechanism fit between these, I would photograph it for but as mine is probably different to yours it might not help.
There is one thing to watch out for WHEN you get your parts list book! Early Heinkels had a rod gear change mechanism, a smaller rear cowl over the engine, and various other differences, so you will have to interpret the book somewhat as it covers early ones. Trojans were further stripped down to cut costs.
It seems to me you are at a crucial stage in your project which I recognise, having been there myself! By the sound of it our two cars had both declined into a  VERY similar condition, almost a point of no return. Despite not being very knowledgeable about cars I persisted. I had a lot of good advice from G-o-g-g-o which I heeded, and I did look at his and other owners' cars, and also looked at the Members Area at www.heinkel-trojan-club.co.uk , this is very useful, as indeed is the members Handbook which contains a lot of information which makes a restoration possible. You really HAVE to get these publications or you will be forever banging your head on a wall, and you will give up, thus wasting all the time effort and money you have already put into it.
I acted on G-o-g-g-o's suggestions and advice, and now am the proud owner of a car, which although unoriginal, was still nice enough to get 2nd place at the National Micro Car Rally in 2007, and it causes a sensation wherever it goes, getting more attention than Lamborghini's and Aston Martins!
Just remember: as one door closes behind you, another slams in your face

adi

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2010, 10:56:30 AM »
Oh. I didnt realize that there ARE any publications about these cars!

Do they sell them to non-club members, or do i need to join them first?

adi

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2010, 11:25:03 AM »
By the way, do you think you could snap a quick picture of the inside of your one? Would be interesting to take a look at what one looks like complete.

Thanks

marcus

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2010, 11:26:11 AM »
I think you need to join the club, but this is not expensive, then you will also be able to buy spare parts, Brochures booklet (containing period pictures and ads) Road Test booklet, merchandise, access to the member's part of the website which includes lots of technical articles, plus all manner of interest and help which will make a HUGE difference to you. I am not on the committee, just a member who knows that the club is VERY good for you at present! I traded in my old Velorex for a Trojan partly because I knew I would have the support of a dedicated club, which also does a nice quarterly magazine. Where do you live?
Just remember: as one door closes behind you, another slams in your face

marcus

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2010, 11:46:14 AM »
You are very lucky! I was supposed to be heading down - at last - to spend Easter with my girlfriend, but work is STILL keeping me tied up, so I have just taken the covers off, will take the seat back off and a get a photo for you. Like I said, mine is a fairly late RHD Trojan and does not have the Heinkel "sill" thing, which runs along the inside wall of the car, about the same height as the top of the hand brake bracket.
Your top pic looks more like the gear lever bracket!
Just remember: as one door closes behind you, another slams in your face

marcus

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2010, 12:14:52 PM »
Let's see if these work:


http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11397.jpg

http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11400.jpg

http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11399.jpg

http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11401.jpg

Remember that my car is a RHD Trojan, so spec is different from Heinkels, and mine has some non-standard things too!
Pic one was taken from above and behind, looking down
pic 2 from the front
pic 3 from front, under the seat
The result of a LOT of work, and plenty of help!
BTW is DT4 your post code, and where is it?
Also you say that you plan to have it on the road for Summer, but if you want to do even a half nice job I think you should aim for Summer next year!

Just remember: as one door closes behind you, another slams in your face

Bob Purton

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2010, 12:55:46 PM »
Thats the first time I have seen your car Marcus, it looks good plus you have the right sticker in the window!

marcus

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2010, 01:02:47 PM »
Cheers Bob, I did drive it down to a RUM Open Day one year, but perhaps you were not there that year. I made sure in advance that the first day it went on the road it had the RUM sticker on the windscreen, a Heinkel Trojan Club Logo Tax Disc holder, and in the instrument panel where Heinkels have a clock and Trojans have a blank disc I saw the ideal place for a H T club windscreen sticker!
Just remember: as one door closes behind you, another slams in your face

adi

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #9 on: April 17, 2010, 11:52:39 PM »
Let's see if these work:


http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11397.jpg

http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11400.jpg

http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11399.jpg

http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11401.jpg

Remember that my car is a RHD Trojan, so spec is different from Heinkels, and mine has some non-standard things too!
Pic one was taken from above and behind, looking down
pic 2 from the front
pic 3 from front, under the seat
The result of a LOT of work, and plenty of help!
BTW is DT4 your post code, and where is it?
Also you say that you plan to have it on the road for Summer, but if you want to do even a half nice job I think you should aim for Summer next year!

Yeah, DT4 is my postcode, its some place in south dorset (or is that west dorset?).

Thanks very much for your pics. So really, it looks more like this:



?

You dont know how fast i work. Iv pretty much done the shell now, just need to do fixtures and fittings and stuff, that took the grand total of about 3 days. I should have done this months ago, but i kept leaving it and doing something else because it was really rusty. But then a few days ago i decided that i dont want to stare at it anymore, and should just get on and do it.

After i sorted the shell out completely i just need to do the engine, which is hard since thers bits missing, and then put it all together. Aiming for June.

Im used to Volkswagens and hotrods, and i actually drive these old junkers, so im not used to having lots of down-time. If i spend too long on a project i just get bored of it and do something else.

This car aint going to be perfect, but i can live with that, at least ill get to DRIVE the damn thing (what its designed for after all) and not just have it sitting in the workshop protecting my floor from dust. Plus i need my workshop back, i got another beetle to roofchop and doing that outside is inconvenient.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2010, 11:58:17 PM by adi »

Big Al

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2010, 01:06:20 PM »
I have the repairable remains of the very panel you are missing. It is a long flange (not a whoop) that runs inside the side of the car to spread the loading. it is about 2 1/2 foot long. The handbrake itself is mounted into a bracket which should have, for the best analogy, a peaked visor on it. This bolts to the sill panel and the floor creating a kind of box section on which the pressure of the handbrake can be loaded. The RHD system is different having a heavy gauge plate mounted on the floor so using a similar handbrake mech saving tooling everything for RHD. A factory bodge in other words. I also have a glove box/speaker panel for the top of the wing and two usable inner wheel arches with some of the outer wing on. No idea why this was removed from the shell as it cannot have been to bad.
Hope the blue print made some sort of sense.
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
Citroen BX 17TZD & GTI 16v
Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs

adi

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2010, 07:03:41 PM »
OOOOh, interasting.

Do you with to sell these parts?

One or two original parts in a Heinkel wouldnt hurt  ;D

Big Al

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Re: Heinkel hand brake bracket?
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2010, 08:55:04 AM »
Yes. Someone bought them on eBay but never collected or completed that deal so I would like them out of the way. I just sold off a load of parts he left here nearly three years ago for the same project. People do this all the time expecting me to restore stuff or something in an open ended contract - I think not - and store it for nothing for years yet never leaving contact details etc. The rules are after a year I can dispose of the stuff to defer costs. I leave it longer but each year something ends up getting sold as it has been here to long and I cannot contact the owner. Some folk never reappear but I have had folk just turn up out of the blue demanding their parts as if they left it last week. They are most upset when they find I have sold it off for costs but none have successfully got passed spluttering as it is all legal. This still goes on despite my not trading for yonks as there are some folk who refuse to listen. All part of the fun of dealing with the public.
The other game is to move stuff left up to Cumbria so when the owner wants to collect he has to do a 600 mile odd round trip to retrieve it on a designated day. This is actually rather amusing as they can hardly grumble if it is free storage but I can charge all costs if they want.
You can have these panels for £30. I am on alanbubblecars@hotmail.com.
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
Citroen BX 17TZD & GTI 16v
Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs