Author Topic: Messerschmitt? or Zeta? that is the Question  (Read 2347 times)

zetasports

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Messerschmitt? or Zeta? that is the Question
« on: October 09, 2010, 04:35:01 AM »
Now that I have passed my Zeta Sports 1001 to Shane Buchanan I am no longer the proud owner of a Zeta, but the good news is that I am now the owner of a Messerschmitt engine with FMR cast into the side cover and a problem.

Am I now a Messerschmitt owner or a Zeta owner, This tiger is changing her stripes so to speak hey?

But seriously Shane and I have been looking long and hard at what exactly we have recovered form the bus in Adelaide,

The more we look at the Frisky photos the more convinced we are that we have a hybrid of Frisky parts and Zeta parts, the seats are frisky, fuel cap is on left side to miss Dome that is the one in the frisky photo I saw today.


The folks at the Bluebird (Boat) Restoration site were dismissive of the zeta story but does anyone have photos of Sir Donnals Campbell at Lake Eyre?

My theory is that Zeta 1001 was Sir Donnald Campbell's runabout from that time with the FMR engine and the first Australian built body taken from a Frisky that Fred Diwell now owns.

Looking carefully at the previous paint work the car has been Red then Metalic blue then green then white before being painted with the Mural, so it is quite likely that the car was the Blue zeta in the Lake eyre photos I have seen years ago.

The Messerschmitt engine I still own is in the Diesel bath trying to free up the water damage to the crank shaft and you can find a report daily on my youtube site robinheath1 or look for Messerschmitt TG500 restoration and please offer advice as I wish to do the best job of restoration we can afford!!

I have spent about $150.00 already on Nuts and bolts and $25.00 at the car wash but the results are good so far and as soon as someone can tell me how to test and wire up the Motor/generator I will be able to test that part as well.

have a good weekend and thanks for the interest and help you have given so far.
Robin Heath




Big Al

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Re: Messerschmitt? or Zeta? that is the Question
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2010, 09:45:03 AM »
The TG500 is not a Messerschmitt it is an FMR and the engine is an FMR production so you are the owner of an FMR not a Messerschmitt if we are being picky. It would seem correct as otherwise the engine would have Messerschmitt cast into it. Not sure Messerschmitt, as a company, ever made an engine. They bought in the technology. FMR was a seperate entity and were kind of forced to build an engine as there was not one to buy in for some reason. I am told the FMR unit for the Zeta Sport is different to that for a TG500, something to do with gearing.

Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
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For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs

zetasports

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Re: Messerschmitt? or Zeta? that is the Question
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2010, 10:46:40 AM »
Thanks for clearing that up Al I always thought that the M in FMR stood for Messerschmitt as I don't understand German I have no Idea of who made what and so the engine is not Messerschmitt at all then?

What about the engines in the four wheel messerschmitt then? should they also call their's FMR"S?

Sorry I am not up on German Industrial History but I always thought they were the same opps sorry.

Big Al

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Re: Messerschmitt? or Zeta? that is the Question
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2010, 11:12:05 AM »
Yep it is an FMR TG500 here. It is not a Messerschmitt Tiger. Messerschmitt was not included in the name and the Tiger name belonged to Rootes. Not sure what it was marketed as in Australia but I suspect FMR TG500. I am no German speaker either but FMR basically stands for Fend Motorworks Regansburg I think. Ferdi or someone will know.
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
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Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs

marcus

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Re: Messerschmitt? or Zeta? that is the Question
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2010, 01:37:41 PM »
Fritz Fend worked for Messerschmitt on aircraft landing gear during the Vera Lynn War. After that he developed his Fend Flitzers, and when he wanted to increase production, he approached Willi Messerschmitt who decided to improve and mass produce the concept under the Messerschmitt name.

For 10 years after the war no German company was allowed to make aircraft, but when Messerschmitt was finally allowed back to plane making, Fend was allowed to continue production, and set up a new company called Fahrzeug Maschinenbau Regensberg which roughly translates as Regensberg Scooter-machine Factory, or more literally as Travel-Thing-Machine Factory, Regensberg.

Heinkel also produced scooters and bubblecars, and BMW, unable to produce aero engines concentrated on cars and motorcycles including building the ISO Isetta under licence. Sachs made the original 175 and 200 engines, and it is believed that Sachs and FMR collaborated on the design of the TG 500 type engines, but Sachs did not feel they were developed sufficiently to have their name on them.
Just remember: as one door closes behind you, another slams in your face

Peelpower

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Re: Messerschmitt? or Zeta? that is the Question
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2010, 04:49:36 PM »
Marcus, i totally agree with you. Perfect explanation.

john Meadows

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Re: Messerschmitt? or Zeta? that is the Question
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2010, 05:25:02 PM »
Up until 1960 all Friskys had a bench seat. The Frisky family three introduced early 1960 ( a year after Gordon had gone to Lightburn)  had single front seats but were nothing like the seats fitted into the Frisky Sprint which were one off like the car.

You should not be surprised to find “Frisky like parts” on the Zeta, after all Gordon designed both cars and did take some Friskys  Sports / Coupes, (not Sprints) to Australia with him.

If you care to email me photos of any “Frisky parts” you kneed identifying I will be happy to help you.

Big Al

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Re: Messerschmitt? or Zeta? that is the Question
« Reply #7 on: October 10, 2010, 10:03:26 AM »
during the Vera Lynn War.

So famous they named a dangly bit of Wales after her! I know as I drove a Messerschmitt along it to the end but I think a Fahrzeug must be something else in Welsh as they weren't very friendly.

Proves I do not know everything, especially things I should know!
Also Friskys do seem to be awfully complicated in there development. One begins to wonder if any two are the same. A real challenge to the restorer while much of the bolt on parts are not to expensive. Why are they not more popular as they offer an intellectual challenge as well as a gratifying and economic restoration of something rather unusual if one is to get the finished car bung perfect?
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
Citroen BX 17TZD & GTI 16v
Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs