It wont start!

[Bob Purton]

After all my efforts rebuilding my 9E I attempted to start it on the bench today , all temporarily wired and fueled, it has a great spark and good compression but It coughs and splats and will not run. Timing is spot on. I can only imagine its the carb, its one that had stood for years, I have cleaned it as best I can but maybe there is a passageway blocked somewhere. Any Villiers 25S carb experts out there? What should I be looking at?

[Stuart Cyphus]

 You'll probably baulk at doing this yourself, but I once had a Ford Zephyr 6 on the banger track which had been standing for 27 years and which was refusing to start. It was displaying the same symptoms as you. We got it running perfectly by advancing the ignition about 2 degrees from standard and then cranked it over whilst emptying a tin of easystart down the air filter and when it catched, keep on squirting it continuously whilst totally flooring the throttle for about two minutes or as long as you can stand the pain. It might sound (and was) brutal, but as I said, it ran perfectly after that for the rest of the time the car existed, and the total time messing about getting it to run was about seven minutes after 27 years standing....

 N.B. I take no responsibility in anyone trying the above with a road car!

[Jonathan Poll]

After all my efforts rebuilding my 9E I attempted to start it on the bench today , all temporarily wired and fueled, it has a great spark and good compression but It coughs and splats and will not run. Timing is spot on. I can only imagine its the carb, its one that had stood for years, I have cleaned it as best I can but maybe there is a passageway blocked somewhere. Any Villiers 25S carb experts out there? What should I be looking at?

I learnt a great trick for cleaning carbs, I tried it out on one of the moped carbs and it works a treat! Helps if you clean as much as you can, speeds up the process, but sounds like you already have.

Take an old pan, like the one you boil eggs with, and fill it about 1/5 lemon juice, and about 2/5 water.

Start putting it on the hob, on high, while you dismantle the carb. Remove all rubber parts, you could damage them. Also, I have to say this process removes paint, so if you have a metal air filter you wanted to degrease, either don;t, or it will need a respray.

When you're done, put all of the non rubber parts of the carburettor in the pan. Best results when "violently boiling" but of course contorl the heat to not boil over.

After about 10 minutes (mine was quite crappy), have a look at it (yours may take 5 minutes if it's already been cleaned), and if it seems OK, rinse in water (with washing up liquid to remove all of the lemon juice). It should look matt aluminium colour.

Result in a picture: http://i29.servimg.com/u/f29/13/39/38/65/125_xl64.jpg



Hope it helps, JP

[richard]

looks great but what ever was in the other 2/5 !

[Barry]

Photoshop?

[richard]

no idea but if i had your address you could try mine - with you in a couple of days 

[Big Al]

I assume you have an exhaust on it. Two strokes like exhausts to make the piston into a good pump. But crappy carbs are common. They get glazed in evaporated fuel etc. It is not always possible to chase out the drilled passages with fuse wire to ensure they are clear, likewise an airline. I like to do this even if I have cleaned the carb by one of the recognized methods. It is amazing the amount of muck that can come out. The acidic/caustic treatments loosens the muck up for sure. Lemon is a usefully mild easy to obtain option. Indeed perhaps preferred to Villit Bang for two stroke engines.

What is the idea. Use the Villiers in place of the yuletide fire over Christmas?

[Bob Purton]

Thanks for the tips lads. It does have an exhaust pipe on it but not a silencer yet as I have yet to build it, that was my next job untill this faulure ground me to a halt. Do you think the extra length of a silencer would make any difference? I've have plenty of motors of this type fired up with no silencer before so I dont think its that though it did cross my mind.
Can you still buy Easystart Stuart? [nice to hear from you again by the way] I havnt seen it in years.
I did boil my carb in vinegar for a few minutes,
I hadnt heard of using lemon juice though, could be worth a try.

I think I have everything connected correctly, I'm turning the crank clockwise looking at the fan[on the right side]. timing 11/64ths before TDC. forward running points being the ones on the right side of the plate set at 20thou.
Thanks for the offer Richard. I will email you.

[richard]

Offerred carb 8 am accepted by 9 posted by 10  the systems working - let's just hope the carb is , ho- ho.it  should be with you sat/mon the man said by way spell check calls it a crab !

[super-se7en (Malc Dudley)]

Just noticed there is a bond minicar complete exhaust on eBay.

[richard]

If its that pretty grotty one too small for bob I think

[g-o-g-g-o]

Hi Bob
         You mentioned the dreaded word VINEGAR in your cleaning operations - never used vinegar because it is a corrosive agent and although it will clean up the aluminium bits on the carb - but leaving some deposits - it corrodes all of the steel parts on the carb - I had to renew Marcus's carb which he "cleaned" with vinegar and I had to replace all af the steel parts some like the spring had virtually disintegrated. I used the old fashoned way of cleaning the carb Petrol  and compressed air once having stripped it all down - where did you get the idea of cleaning it with vinegar - out of a boys book of how to save money???
                                                                                                                                                                              Mike

[Barry]

Evidently , vinegar is good on crabs?

[Bob Purton]

Hi Mike. Vineger will do that if you leave it in for any length of time, after all it is acid. I had good results with it on my moped carbs, I neutralise it afterwards with a detergeant. I use the quick boil method, you have to remember mike that I dismantle and clean ancient machinery for a living, have done for thirtyfive years, Marcus can be excused for doing it wrong and messing up his carb on account of him only being a uke player!

[Bob Purton]

Well spotted Malcolm. These things always turn up too late having just forked out for a new Greeves pipe and the materials to make the silencer.