Author Topic: Silent blocks verses rod ends.  (Read 7382 times)

steven mandell

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Re: Silent blocks verses rod ends.
« Reply #15 on: February 18, 2014, 11:06:50 PM »
Good work!
 Got pictures of your rod ends?

Bob Purton

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Re: Silent blocks verses rod ends.
« Reply #16 on: February 19, 2014, 09:15:50 AM »
I'm not the worlds neatest welder but nothing has ever dropped off! Here is a shot of the rod ends although a rod end is a rod end.. I intend to fit the rubber boots that McGill Motor sport sell to keep the dirt out of them.
You may not recognize the track rods [Americans call them tie rods I think] Again, the ones I had were very badly corroded and as the eyes on each end are lightly welded on I didn't want to trust them so made new ones.. I used  some new earthing rods I spotted in the local scrap metal yard, what you drive into the ground for electrical systems. They are half inch diameter mild steel solid rods with a copper coating which is easily turned off on the lathe. I then bought a pair of short turn buckles  which I cut in half and welded to either end of the rods to get the left and right hand threads, it was cheaper to do this than buy a left handed M10 tap! I didn't just weld them end to end you understand, I bored them and turned the end of the rods down to insert then welded around the shoulder. Much stronger that way. The new set up will weigh a little more but at least I'm confident they are strong enough for the job. Despite all the afore mentioned I'm not really one for modifications and like my cars original  but as its a project car and I'm using all the rubbish left overs it kind of lends its self to some artistic license.   
« Last Edit: February 19, 2014, 09:21:08 AM by Bob Purton »

Big Al

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Re: Silent blocks verses rod ends.
« Reply #17 on: February 19, 2014, 09:45:52 AM »
Bot pic is the item I fought most on Nobs. The transfer of the steering from inside to outside. Every car I had suffered play here. It takes a lot of strain, especially if the working system is winding up several rubbers. It would appear not to have been man enough for the job.

The rack was not such a source of issues as it is, as you point out, adjustable. Bit like the Heinkel, with offset bushings. In the Heinkel these are carried in rubbers and the insert rotates inside these. A very neat steering rack results, few parts, light and accurate. Then you look at other manufacturers efforts and have to snigger and the complex things they cam up with. Think Ernst wins this one even over my beloved Goggo, which does have a flaw to trap the unwary. If I had been doing the Bobette I would have been tempted to ditch the Nob system for the Heinkel one as long is it mounted in the correct place outside. Half the joints are gone directly. The top bush is a better job too.

Hmm, all the best bits of microdesign in one car. What would that look like? No, it would not be a Messerschmitt Tiger before its said! AC Type 70?  ;D ;D ;D
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
Citroen BX 17TZD & GTI 16v
Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs

Bob Purton

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Re: Silent blocks verses rod ends.
« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2014, 10:13:33 AM »
Well you know what owners of microcars were like in the 60's. Nobody ever serviced there cars! That transfer arm and bushes have a nice big grease nipple on them but how many of them ever saw a grease gun? Mine in the picture is a whole new steel tub with new bushes and pin. I used oilite bushes , don't know if they will fare any better but at least they will not be tugging against six silent blocks! I was considering a different rack until I sorted this one out. Lets start a new thread on the ideal parts microcar.

Big Al

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Re: Silent blocks verses rod ends.
« Reply #19 on: February 20, 2014, 10:53:53 AM »
Indeed composite car elsewhere.

Likewise renewing the system gives it a chance to show what it can do. Maybe regular servicing will find it live long, maybe it is a weak design. There is interest in proving it on its own account despite the rest of the vehicle. I am sure you have enjoyed the rebuild as well.

Wish Dad had schooled me on machine tools, but he was very reluctant, despite being good in his younger days before management and an MSc called after the war. That generation who did wartime reserved occupation were very skilled. To the extent that when a part of Fairey went on strike he, and the other managers, all time served, went into the machine shop to finish a rush order and turned it round faster and to a higher quality than the men. Needless to say the strike was somewhat undermined by that and the immediate man management taken much more seriously. Several of those guys become some of Dad's 'young men' and built good carriers off the floor. Clearly he considered I had not the natural ability. Humph.
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
Citroen BX 17TZD & GTI 16v
Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs

Bob Purton

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Re: Silent blocks verses rod ends.
« Reply #20 on: February 20, 2014, 12:01:28 PM »
Its not too late Al. I'm self taught and that's why I'm not that good truth be known. With me its more craft based as a carry over from restoration work. Going back to Nobel steering lever bearings, with that massive pin and fossy bronze bushes its hard to see why they did wear out, one reason could be road grit getting into the grease as it open to the elements under the car. I was going to say "just a theory" but I dont want to tempt Jims pedantic side.   

steven mandell

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Re: Silent blocks verses rod ends.
« Reply #21 on: February 20, 2014, 12:47:23 PM »
You are right.
Both you and Al are blessed with a similarly high degree of intuitive engineering sense.
I have often wished to have enough space in the garage for a compact lathe/ mill/ drill, as my sharing of your perfectionism (blessing or curse that it be), leads me to believe that respectable machining would be an inevitable eventual result of such an arrangement.

AndrewG

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Re: Silent blocks verses rod ends.
« Reply #22 on: February 20, 2014, 07:23:02 PM »
It is often assumed that rod ends are a superior product but they don't have a very long lifespan if used under a car in a British winter with salt, grit, etc.  Possibly no problem for a hobby car if it will mostly see only fair days.

There are sealed rod ends available that overcome the problem but they tend to be very expensive if engineering products or to have appalling levels of friction if they are automotive track rod ends.  They were used in motorcycle 'funny front ends' where the friction caused a serious weave, and the back yard mechanic technique was to put the taper pin in a drill chuck and 'run them in' until the friction dropped.