RUMCars Forum
General Category => Unusual Microcar Discussion => Topic started by: David Dale on February 05, 2015, 07:41:45 PM
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Hi, this is my first post, so I hope I get everything right when attaching the photos
I have some pictures of a prototype bubble car that may not be on the RumCars register. As my late father Jack Dale was involved in the team that made the car I would dearly love to trace it, if it still exists? It would be great to see further pictures of it, or see it in the flesh.
The car is a Swift and was built by Southern Aircraft (Gatwick) Ltd. I think the designer would have been my father's boss John Ernest Coxon.
From the pictures it appears to be powered by a twin cylinder 2-stroke Villiers engine (250cc ?) and has a central driving position, with two rear set passenger seats. The car has gull wing doors and is of a GRP monocoque construction, with the steering and front suspension in one assembly and the rear suspension and power unit in another.
I think the car was built in the late 1950s and did not go into production due to the launch of the Mini and the cost of getting a glass manufacturer to tool up for producing the windows. The prototype had Perspex windows and headlamp cowls.
There was a rumour that the prototype went to America, but I cannot be sure of that.
Please could someone let me know if the car is already on your register?
If it is not on the register, should it be put onto the register? (I have no more details than the photos you see here and those I have shared with you from my memory).
Has anyone seen this car, or photos different from mine?
Does anyone know whether it still exists and its whereabouts?
Thanks for reading this and I look forward to your responses.
Regards
David Dale
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh635/nulli-secundus/Me/Swift/SouthernAircraftSwift1_zps1b0d618e.jpg)
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh635/nulli-secundus/Me/Swift/SouthernAircraftSwift2_zpsc36fbe4c.jpg)
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh635/nulli-secundus/Me/Swift/SouthernAircraftSwift3_zps0adc8f67.jpg)
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh635/nulli-secundus/Me/Swift/SouthernAircraftSwift4_zpsed630df8.jpg)
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh635/nulli-secundus/Me/Swift/SouthernAircraftSwift_zps2198f56d.jpg)
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really great , would love to know more
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Its a new one on me! I wonder if Jean has any knowledge of it?
Regarding putting it on the register, the register is to record actual surviving cars so at this stage it would not be appropriate but let hope it turns up somewhere.
Thanks very much for posting. Most interesting.
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A new one on me too, but what what a great looking little car. I cannot provide any help, but hope more comes to light, and I am sure others here would do too.
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Thank you all for taking interest in my first post on this forum and to contributing to it.
The main aims of my post were:
• To share this car with you all
• Perhaps discover its existence, or fate
• To discuss the virtues of its looks and design
However, the discussion seems to have wandered off into whether it should be included in the register (no it does not meet the criteria), the paper archive (maybe one day, but not now for the prints are all I have), or a digital archive (I certainly hope so and the more the merrier! Thanks Barry for adding it to yours!).
Please can we get back to these main aims of my post and perhaps start another thread for discussing registers and archives?
To me the Swift looks to be a very attractive car and by virtue of the wheel placement, suspension and seating arrangements, should have been very good in the handling department.
Thanks Malc Dudley for the comment about the rear suspension looking similar to the Lightburn Zeta. That is most interesting.
AndyL, I am sorry I do not know why it has a De Dion rear suspension at the back.
I am not aware of what parts of the car my father Jack worked on. He worked for Southern Aircraft throughout WW2 and stayed with them to the early 1960s. I am not sure if he worked there pre war. He was a skilled sheet metal worker and was also a good welder and fabricator. I attach a few pictures of a swinging arm rear suspension conversion that he designed for his 500 Ariel Red Hunter and made as a “homework job” at Southern Aircraft. I would argue that the rear suspension design of the car has some similarities with my Father’s Ariel, which was made in the early 1950s and predates the car project. But whether my Father was responsible for the rear sub-frame on the car is pure speculation.
My Father must have had a good working relationship with his boss John Coxon, for on occasions Mr Coxon would take him on flights, or should that be frights, in his aeroplane and these would often involve acrobatic stunts..........
I have also attached a faint photocopy of the side view photograph and it has been hand painted in light blue and what with this, and the appearance of the car in the black and white photographs, I wonder whether this prototype car was painted light metallic blue in colour. What do you think?
I would welcome as much advice as you can give me into researching the whereabouts, or fate of this car.
Thanks again and regards
David
PS I hope the bike pictures are not breaking any forum rules.
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh635/nulli-secundus/Me/Swift/Swift_zps333c5f59.jpg)
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh635/nulli-secundus/Me/Swift/1948SwingingArmConversion500ArielRedHunter_zpsac769b6f.jpg)
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh635/nulli-secundus/Me/Swift/2014-02-16141850_zps01ecf1cf.jpg)
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh635/nulli-secundus/Me/Swift/2014-02-16141831_zpscc3e6415.jpg)
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Hi all. As this thread wandered off onto another subject I have been asked to split the thread. Any comments or information regarding the Swift please post here. More on the register or archive see new subject, Register and archive. Purpose and future.
Thanks. Bob
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surely i cant be the only one spotting a similarity with the 1957 Meadows Bug - if so John Meadows at the Frisky Register is your man I certainly see a strong resemblance . This could actually be a different body on the same chassis ?
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surely i cant be the only one spotting a similarity with the 1957 Meadows Bug - if so John Meadows at the Frisky Register is your man I certainly see a strong resemblance . This could actually be a different body on the same chassis ?
I agree that there is a resemblance, but I think the Swift has a larger footprint.
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Maybe but these cars are only realised for the miniatures they are when you put a driver in them , how large does the number plate on the SWIFT appear ? and if you moved the gull wing doors aft on the second car and added a bit of body at the front and rear you are getting there . The both cars have a narrower rear track and if the front and rear chassis are seperate the car could have been extended or shortened , not that i am sure it has been . My money is on it being the same basic car , I am sure thats possible
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Maybe but these cars are only realised for the miniatures they are when you put a driver in them , how large does the number plate on the SWIFT appear ? and if you moved the gull wing doors aft on the second car and added a bit of body at the front and rear you are getting there . The both cars have a narrower rear track and if the front and rear chassis are seperate the car could have been extended or shortened , not that i am sure it has been . My money is on it being the same basic car , I am sure thats possible
I agree that the design of the front and rear sub assemblies of the Swift does lend itself to being incorporated into bodies of different length. Do you know when the Meadows Bug was designed and built? It appear to me the the Swift was a little too late on the scene. Had it been designed earlier it may have had a future.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meadows_Frisky
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There is definitely a strong resemblance, but it is hard to judge relative size without knowing what size wheels each car used. However the Swift has been designed as a staggered 3 seater and does seem to be longer and perhaps wider than the Bug. Furthermore, it is not unusual of different cars designed to similar requirements and budgets ending up looking similar. I prefer the Swift's styling, but notice that there is quite a difference between the height of the windscreen and of the side windows, looks like a driver might have to be tallish to see out of the windscreen and shortish to see out of the side windows!
It is a fascinating car, and hope more information comes to light, and it would be fantastic if it has survived.
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I have made a preliminary sweep of the topic and come up with no really good leads. Very tenuous is we are back into aircraft. Here the company was a CRO. Bedson flirted with many aircraft companies but seemed unsettled in employment. Someone commented on the Zeta look of the suspension on the Swift. Was this Bedson throwing the dice to get his existing work into use through friend, or contact, at Southern Aircraft? Did he have dealings with Mr Cuxon?
Thanks Big Al :) I would have no idea if Bedson had any contact with Southern Aircraft, or Mr Coxon.
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I rather like this Swift. It would seem it was to late into the field. Looks a bit Villiers 3Tish to me, but could be a 250cc. Not quite sure I am understanding the rear drive. Is there a diff? Its Brutsch meets Heinkel on steroids.
So do I Big Al !! Don't know about a differential. I am sure they would have known of the need for one, given the backgrounds of the people concerned. During the war Southern Aircraft also serviced and repaired military vehicles.
I would like to think it is a 3T, whereas I am sure my Dad would have liked to see a V twin Vincent engine in it....... ;D
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Ideally all four wheelers should have a diff but this was the period where to save money cars with narrow tracks were being produced without one. The tyres just scuffed around corners.
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Hi
I am in Spain at the moment but have put out a couple of feelers.
Your are right in that Gordon Bedson was well into planes (They eventually killed him) so there is a possibility but a thin one.
I'll let you know
John
PS there is a hell of a lot of snow in Spain!!!!.
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There will be a chain drive from the 3T to the rear axle unit with u/js to the drive shafts. I would be very surprised if there was a diff unit is in there.
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I was going to mention the prototype 'Bug'. Placed with the artwork for the Gullwing Frisky there is a clear fellowship of design with the Swift at the end. The seating makes sense with the long gullwing door, but the car is overall larger than a Frisky, I think.
Having got the images of the suspension it is surely a case of working backwards to see if it shares commonality with the Bug. I am assuming the Bug was made for Meadows, if so, it will be their intellectual property and only 'sold' to a third party. That does not fit with the narrative of making the Swift car at, or by folk, at a different company.
Bedson seems to have been quite good at inheriting projects ideas he was around, but did not own. So he would have little worry in repeating an idea with someone else. His time with Lightburn seemed to be something of a frustration. Lightburn himself comes over as awkward.
It my even have been a link with Lightburn that set the Swift in motion. Remember the Zeta had the 3T fitted to it. The Zeta Sports, Bedson's first project there, the FMR500, with diff. Bedson left after the Saab sportscar did not happen. and Lightburn dicked about for several more years before putting the Zeta Sport for sale. through the Alfa agencies, allegedly.
Now looking at history and Bedson. He become a flight engineer and flew in converted Halifax under BOAC for a time. CRO firms would more than likely be used to convert the Halifax to civilian spec to go into service. There is an immediate link in two career paths going way back. He gained engineering qualifications enough to join Vickers on the Valiant project in a pretty high managerial level. Yet no one seems quite sure where this qualifications came from. CRO would be ideal as a place to learn and obtain such qualifications. Remembering my Father's immediate put down of Bedson's engineering pedigree, compared to his and the Vickers team, when he hove into view with the Frisky, and that sort of an idea flies (Ha) for me. Designers of state of the art flight would be a bit snotty about a qualification earned adapting their groups original designs. This area would be worth researching as it feels right for links, later to fruit into the Swift, even if Bedson was not in the UK at the time.
Lastly there is Bedson and racing cars. Is there evidence in your family, or at work, or with Cuxon, of any racing car interests. Bedson was particularly known for working with Alan Brown and Kieft.
I suppose there is no date mentioned for the pictures or the Swift project?
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Is there evidence in your family, or at work, or with Coxon, of any racing car interests. Bedson was particularly known for working with Alan Brown and Kieft.
I suppose there is no date mentioned for the pictures or the Swift project?
I don't think there was any specific connection with racing cars, but that is not to say there was no interest motor racing. My Father was certainly interested in racing cars and motorcycles. I think Mr John Ernest Coxon may have been a fan of large American cars, but I am making this assumption on the fact that my Father did some repairs on some for him.
Unfortunately there are no dates on the photographs that I have. I remember my Father describing the Morris Minor, in one of the pictures, as a contemporary car, which I suppose was to drum into me how modern the Swift looked for the time. Because the launch of the Mini was one of the reasons that the car did do go into production, I think it is reasonable that these pictures, and the car itself, date from around 1958 or 1959.
Thank you for all the ideas for possible connections between people, businesses and other cars.
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The dates you mention, and possibly a little later, feel right, don't they. Need some clear time to understand how this stacks up. John M might well hold info, at home, he has not got in mind on his holidays. Might take a while, but its a direction to look at, on logic and evidence to hand.
I assume there are no clues to the thought of an American connection. Pity.
I revisited the Rootes Slug. Only very vague similarities. The Slug was based on a Goggomobil. Doubt it was anything more than, perhaps, an influence to go ahead and try the Swift design. Rootes realised that what became the Imp was not going to be a microcar too. So your father's thinking was correct, and unless a large budget was available, sadly discretion was probably the best action. Thank goodness for the pictures remaining.
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Al , you have referred to the " Rootes slug " before I believe . I hazard a guess that I am not the only one to be baffled by this one - what is it and why ? Thanks
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Here is an early version of the Slug but apparently there was an even earlier project dubbed Little Jim.
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And there hangs the benefit of recording cars that no longer exist but for which facts are known, as I could direct you to the file resource. As it is I either now become unhelpful, and suggest you did what I did and research the topic, a lot easier with the Web, but done using books etc when I did it, or I now have to take up a large part of the day repeating an item written in the dim distant passed, before I had a PC. Case proven, I believe, even if its on another thread.
The middle road is to find some pictures as that seems to calm people down. I will do that as I am more interested in finding a cross reference to the Swift.
(http://)
(http://)
The first picture, if it works, is the clay of Slug. It was to use a flat twin engine. Note how similar it is to the Meadows/Micholotti gullwing door car. The actual prototype is recognisable as a Goggo base. Little Jim is a half way house between this and the Imp. It is a more normal looking car going square.
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(http://)
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(http://)
Making a mess of these images. Anyway the last one is a different take on the first clay. Looks damned daft to me but this is what stylists do.
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Thanks for that both I appreciate that - even if it's made even more of a mess of this thread so I will get off ;)
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The dates you mention, and possibly a little later, feel right, don't they. Need some clear time to understand how this stacks up. John M might well hold info, at home, he has not got in mind on his holidays. Might take a while, but its a direction to look at, on logic and evidence to hand.
I assume there are no clues to the thought of an American connection. Pity.
I revisited the Rootes Slug. Only very vague similarities. The Slug was based on a Goggomobil. Doubt it was anything more than, perhaps, an influence to go ahead and try the Swift design. Rootes realised that what became the Imp was not going to be a microcar too. So your father's thinking was correct, and unless a large budget was available, sadly discretion was probably the best action. Thank goodness for the pictures remaining.
Yes the dates do feel right.
I am afraid I can only work from my memory on what my Father told me and this was probably several years prior to his death in 1999.
Unfortunately I have no hard evidence about an American connection. However, I think it is fair to say that John Coxon had a penchant for American cars. I would also speculate that perhaps he may have had business dealings with the USA with regards to aircraft parts, tooling, etc, etc.
When I mentioned the rumour that the car may have gone to America, I dressed it down, as I was basing it on what my Father had told me, in that he thought it had gone to America. I do not recall our conversation continuing as to why it would have gone to America, but if it did, I would imagine that either Mr Coxon was looking for a backer, or he reasoned that the Swift may of had a future in the USA, if it managed to preceed the Mini getting big there.
My first car was a 1966 Imp, now an Imp unit in the back of a Swift would have been quite a handful !
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I have just thought of something else that may, or may not, be connected. My Father always seemed to know a few stories about the Allards of Allard Cars fame, and they were the sort of tales that only those that knew them would know. As my Father did not know them I wonder if John Coxon did? Some Allards did have American V8 engines I think.
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Yes, the faster Allards used US V8s. Sydney Allard's first major foray into making cars was converting a Morgan 3 wheeler sports car into a 4 wheeler (Brooklands Books Morgan Gold Portfolio).
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sorry to harp on a point but could anyone get the scale of the Swift photograph worked out ? see two pics from Sparrows book show that without a driver , or something else to compare , a microcar may appear " normal " size until you put a driver in it ;)
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sorry to harp on a point but could anyone get the scale of the Swift photograph worked out ? see two pics from Sparrows book show that without a driver , or something else to compare , a microcar may appear " normal " size until you put a driver in it ;)
I am not sure what sizes those distinctive wheel embellishers on the Swift come in, but I have seen them on other microcars. I have zoomed in on a tyre and it looks like they are 12" wheels, so based on this and my calculations.....I think the wheel base is 6 foot.
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh635/nulli-secundus/Me/Swift/Capture_zpsccbc55b0.jpg)
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Yep 125 by 12. Large wheels for a microcar. Look like the same sort of stuff as might fitted to Invacar Mk12, though on a different hub carrier. If so something pretty common on the Girling front and off the shelf rims.
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and i would have thought the bug a little less with maybe 10" wheels - oh well , but .....
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So if we continue to link the Swift with Lightburn ideas, what evidence is there?
I have drawn a blank on a good picture of the Zeta Sports suspension. The Zeta was front wheel drive. I could not say that the Swift front assembly has much in common with the Zeta. However the Zeta did use the Villiers 3T engine. It did have a chain diff. Who made them? Considering Lightburn had a pretty extensive business he could have done these in house. Villiers, equally could have made them. But how many 4 wheel cars used the 3T? Back to Frisky, and its 3T cars, Did they have this diff? Where did it come from?
There is some indications that the rear suspension shares Zeta Sports ideas. It is of passing interest that the Zeta, Zeta Sport and Swift use a sardine tin, non villiers, airfilter.
The Zeta used 12 inch wheels in conjunction with the 3T engine. The Zeta Sports, 10 inch wheels in conjunction with the FMR 500 unit. The 12 inch wheel and tyres look the same spec. If the diff is one and the same than it is clear the gearing is already worked out, why change it?
Some good info or pics of the Zeta suspension would pretty much confirm the Swift as an independent spin off from the Frisky stable. Assuming the car dates to post Zeta there is a logical progression.
However until the evidence is clear we are no further ahead. I have not had time to look at personnel, a lot more time consuming.
Any one else?
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What a beautiful looking car, reminds me a little of the Mink, what was the inspiration for that one? The Swift maybe better looking than the Bug, though gullwing's are somewhat flawed. I wonder how many gullwing bubble cars actually made it into production! None, other than the odd electric French thing.
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Hmmm
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Ha gotcha blob :) nice too hear from you :) where've you been ?
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What a beautiful looking car, reminds me a little of the Mink, what was the inspiration for that one? The Swift maybe better looking than the Bug, though gullwing's are somewhat flawed. I wonder how many gullwing bubble cars actually made it into production! None, other than the odd electric French thing.
The Bamby, but not for long.
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What a beautiful looking car, reminds me a little of the Mink, what was the inspiration for that one? The Swift maybe better looking than the Bug, though gullwing's are somewhat flawed. I wonder how many gullwing bubble cars actually made it into production! None, other than the odd electric French thing.
The French gullwing pop up toaster. Bombing Baguettes for the Bourgeoisie.
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Of course Barry there's that too and I don't think Schmitt's and Inters count either. A canopy isn't a true gullwing. Less than 10 then, a lot of after thought approaches.
Richard, house renovating has 90% of my attension, though am awaiting the unveiling of Bobbette and the Beaulieu Autojumble!
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You do know that Cursor is Barry's pride and joy don't you Blob? You may not like them but that's a bit strong.
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On the contrary I'm not saying I hate them, more they're poorly designed. Anyway, I thought Barry's favourite was the Willam. Coincidentally just found a rather good pic of him on a Lambretta site presenting said vehicle, although there are a number of statements following the Cursors reputation on this site greater than my minor comment!
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Oh by the way I dont think that even from the excellent photographs there's a way of telling whether it's a Villiers 2T 250 or 3T 324cc ? by sight - one is just the bored out version of the other . I think that in all other ways they are identical ? Perhaps Steven could tell us if that's correct ?
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Externally, a 2T blower looks very similar to a 3T blower. The 4T was a development of the 2T for use in a Bond. Modified cylinders and heads for cooling purposes I believe. The 3T though is a different beast. Bottom ends are similar to the 2T and 4T but the cylinders are not simply bored out from the 2T as I found out when I tried to upgrade my Bond G 250 Twin to a 324 Twin by swapping the pistons, barrels and heads...........
I would say the engine shown in the Swift is a 3T and has some very similar unique features seen on a Frisky 3T.
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(http://)
Here we have a picture of the Zeta Sport front suspension. There is a similarity, but it is not the same. Then, as mentioned this is a low car on 10 inch wheels meant as a sporting car. That is significantly different to carrying three people on 12 inch wheels. Also the fact that the front and rear assemblies are pictured as units suggests that the Swift is either a GRP Monocoque with the axles inserted, or a GRP shell with chassis onto which the subassemblies are bolted. This construction differs from the Frisky series and Zeta.
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(http://)
The rear suspension on the Zeta Sport. We really need a couple of other shots but this seem more consistent with that which we see on the Swift rear subassembly. The tube going across is in place of the drive shafts so as to allow the car to roll and have the rear suspension remain in place. Goggo owners will know the problem.
I am not convinced myself, but there is enough to suggest common thought.
With respect to the 3T. It is not a simple overbore of the 2T. I believe the single piston that fits is a 2H and that will not fit an overbored 2T. So quite what the difference is I do not know. The 3T certainly performs very well and a Berkeley with one in happily outclassed its Excelsior twin chums. Its a great shame the 3T was so late into the field. There are a few microcars that would have benefited from it. Is a 4T as lively as the 3T?
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I bought two 3T engines from Australia last year that came out of lightburn zeta cars.
This photo shows the rear of the engine with the chain driven final drive and half shafts. Note the cross tube and suspension mounting.
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Indeed, again not the same but similar. Perhaps forced by the mounts and need to support in that position. Its not convincing, is it.
What are the 3T going in? Frisky?
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The best 3T is going into by blue sport with the other as a spare.
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Lovely :D sorry I had it that Steven bought two 3t's from Australia , good on yer Sport :) still unsure about the visible, and invisible , differences are between the 2 and 3 T are
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Hi Dave
Sorry I am not able to contribute to this discussion on your very interesting micro.
I have put out a couple of feelers but being in Spain makes it a little difficult to follow up as they are not on the web.
Info on the Frisky Bug prototype, Gull wing and Sprint can be found on the Frisky Web site under Prototypes and information on Gordon Bedson with both his Automobile and Aviation hats on under People. The later being written by David Young in Australia.
I wish you luck with your investigations, its a great looking little car
Regards
John
www.meadowsfrisky.co.uk
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Hi John,
Thank you for your help and interest with this. Also thanks for the information on Gordon Bedson and the other cars. I have a feeler out of my own at the moment, but so far nothing has come of it.
Regards
Dave
Hi everyone,
I would like to thank you all for showing an interest in my quest to find more information on this car and perhaps learn of its whereabouts. I have been completely overwhelmed by it all and I am very grateful for the research you are doing behind the scenes.
If I find out anything more about this car, or Mr Coxon, I will post an update here, as filling in small gaps may help in “connecting the dots”.
I have been finding all the responses to my initial post fascinating and I am learning a lot.
Thanks again and regards
Dave
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Lovely :D sorry I had it that Steven bought two 3t's from Australia , good on yer Sport :) still unsure about the visible, and invisible , differences are between the 2 and 3 T are
bigger pots/pistons ? (do 4t's have a shorter con rod ?) , whatever a pair of S19's will do them the world of good - did wonders on my 4T .
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Think all share the same rod and I thought barrels/heads as the Villiers books say that it was just a bore out ( 7mm ) but Grant was hinting at darker mysteries . I am pretty sure 2t to 4t is just extra transfer ports and different head finning to suit the Bond as I don't think the 4T was ever used on a two wheeler ?
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I thought it was something to do with the bottom end power , did'nt Villiers alter the crank/big end area for differing stroke on the 4T to suit the Bond .?
The Franny Barntts had a 2T in them - our local bobby had one in the late 50's early 60's .
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I would think the cars needed more torque at lower speed. Also high revs were out as the dynostart would become an inertial problem, as opposed to a mag. Very often why shoving a pure bike engine into a car with less 'power' does not actually workout as particularly drivable.
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Hi John,
Thank you for your help and interest with this. Also thanks for the information on Gordon Bedson and the other cars. I have a feeler out of my own at the moment, but so far nothing has come of it.
Regards
Dave
Hi everyone,
I would like to thank you all for showing an interest in my quest to find more information on this car and perhaps learn of its whereabouts. I have been completely overwhelmed by it all and I am very grateful for the research you are doing behind the scenes.
If I find out anything more about this car, or Mr Coxon, I will post an update here, as filling in small gaps may help in connecting the dots”.
I have been finding all the responses to my initial post fascinating and I am learning a lot.
Thanks again and regards
Dave
I agree that many have brought interesting and valuable observations and considerations into this discussion, and have with held my impression from the get go, so as not to stifle the fun.
But to be honest, I simply didn't want to burst anybody's bubble car bubble with my first impression that I am still stuck with.
That is that all similarities of both style and engineering are only period specific, but not more than that.
I think that the obvious similarity between Frisky and Zeta Sport front suspensions clearly show that they are designed by the same hand, but I have seen nothing compelling linking the subject of this discussion with other works beyond the fact that they were created in the same era.
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I am coming to that opinion, myself. Certain choices create constraints. Like picking what I feel sure is a 3T power unit. Clearly it is predisposed to look something like a Frisky. So there has to be a good match to say there was a link. Its not really showing up, if it is there. After all just seeing the opposition designs is enough to crib an idea.
That said a bit of time to read up might yet offer information. Might not be what I am looking for, but something else entirely. Its the thrill of the chase. It would also be very interesting to find the in tact car, if it exists.
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Exciting update. Today I have just made contact on Facebook with John Coxon's grandaughter. Fingers crossed with regards to more information. :)
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A few clues would set the hare up again, I think. Be great if the current resting place is known.
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Tonight I met John Coxon, who was the designer of the Swift bubble car.
He is 81 years old and a fascinating man to talk to. He is also extremely clever and still working on designs and inventions.
Sadly the car no longer exists. He thinks my father was responsible in rolling the steel to make the buck that the mould was made from.
The car was economical and had a top speed of 60 mph.
John Coxon was working on a rotary piston engine for the car, which might have been something special !!
He is looking out some other docs for me, so there could be further details to emerge :)
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What a shame. Still good to have met Mr Coxon.
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It is a shame, but it was also a bit of a pipedream to hope I would meet Mr Coxon and that happened :)
The amazing thing, having moved to South Africa and then returned to the UK, Mr Coxon lives less than 17 miles from me.
I should add that there were two John Coxon's (father and son) at Southern Aircraft Gatwick who were both my father's boss. I met the son and he was the the main man on the bubble car project.
If I get more information on this car I will share it here.
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Hi everyone,
It has been a long time since I have been on this site and I thought I should provide a little update on the Swift.
The first is that it was known as the Southern Swift and not just Swift. I found this out after buying a limited production book "History of Southern Aircraft (Gatwick) Limited" by Peter Amos & Brian Buss.
The book included two paragraphs and three photographs on the Southern Swift. Two of the photos I have not seen before. They would not scan well and it would breach copyright if I did so.
The following is in my own words, but based on the opinion of the book authors:-
The SAG Southern Swift was slightly larger in design and better suited to road traffic than not only the then current rival bubble cars offered by Heinkel and Messerschmitt in Germany, but also many from the UK including the Italian Issetta manufactured under licence by BMW in Brighton. Despite the Southern Swift’s advantages to the opposition it did not attract any interest by established manufacturers to put it into production.
By 1962 SAG decided to stop marketing the Southern Swift and also cease trading.
Footnote: I remember my father coming home from work and telling my mother he had been sacked. She was giving me a bath in front of the fire in the kitchen.
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Dear David
Thank you for the update.
Chris Thomas
The Archive of Microcars