2010 Great Pacific Northwest Microcar/Minicar Extravaganza

[mharrell]

For the upcoming microcar meet in Forest Grove, Oregon (just outside Portland) on 11-13 June, 2010,

http://mphspecialties.com/registration.html

Mark Hatten has posted a video from one of the rides I gave in my KV Mini 1 during the 2008 meet:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uP7CJ3uNVBI

as evidence that the car can move under its own power.  Bonus points for anyone correctly identifying the sticker on the windscreen!

[marcus]

Great video! Looks like a fair bit of body roll on that left hand bend. The sticker appears to start with a "R" in the shape of a bubble car, cannot think what that could be! Going along the drive the approaching KR looks fairly big, and the new Mini looks like a limo! Is it right that stone rollers drive the wheels? I wish I had thought of that when I made the electric reversing arrangement for my old Velorex. I used radiator hose on a metal roller which only gave about 2 minutes use before it wore out. I made it so that replacement was not too hard, but it still became a chore. And before you ask, I moved heaven and earth trying to get the dynastart replaced or re-wired, and eventually resorted to using a modern starter motor, a spur gear on the crankshaft, and another starter motor on a pivot for reverse.

[Jean]

Thank you so much for having the RUMCAR windscreen sticker in plain view  - a great advert for the Register which is now truly international.           Jean

[mharrell]

Jean,

You're more than welcome.  Glad to spread the word.


marcus,

Thanks!  It looks like Jean beat you to the definitive identification; you were so close.  For a more obscure challenge, note the small badge at the bottom of the dashboard centered under the speedometer.  It's for an entirely inappropriate car club, yet it seems to fit despite having gotten things turned round.

The rollers, as equipped by the factory, are grindstones from Norton Abrasives:  part number 9550 TR/MN A12-VB7.  This is apparently an obsolete number and I haven't been able to cross-reference it to a current product.  My attempts to contact the company have gone unanswered-- I'm fairly certain they don't believe I'm serious.

Oh, and you're quite right about those monstrously oversized Messerschmitts.  They'll run a guy right off the road.

[marcus]

Oh I was being silly and vague, I knew at once what it is, hence the exclamation mark! I can hardly see the other sticker though, let alone make out what it is. Hope you can source more rollers.

[Big Al]

eventually resorted to using a modern starter motor, a spur gear on the crankshaft, and another starter motor on a pivot for reverse.

I seem to remember the business end of an angle grinder being in there somewhere as well. It worked well when it had a good battery. However put in a nurk with a near flat was a mistake as he fluffed the job, then could not manage to get gears, then catch the engine bump starting. Knackered by the effort he was sentanced to 15 minutes of pull starting. When he still failed to get it going I had a go and it fired second go! Velorex, only for the intiated I think. Anyway the car is happy living on a Yorkshire Farm with a friend and my old Goli and Bamby.

[Big Al]

Give up on the second badge, cannot make it out so probably not something I recognize. I found one of these KV's near Toulouse but did not go through with a deal. Perhaps wrong but I was doubtful of the price being matched if I wanted to sell. Guy had Solyto as well which if I remember correctly was a linked product. The stone drive is not why the car is called a Cavey. A soft top Peel Trident would make an excellent Wacky Races Bouldermobil. Damn another Isetta head!

[marcus]

M (Mike?) Harrell is henceforth known as Captain KVman!
Yes, the gearbox of an angle grinder set the rubber coated roller at the required 90º to the motor. I always used to drive and park as if there was no reverse, and that system was basically for emergencies like getting out of the way when stalled.
The starter motor worked perfectly when used in harmony with the Jawa's highly tricky starting behaviour. To allow one person to start or re-start it from the seat (necssary in London!) I added a cable to set the air intake / choke correctly, then another cable to pull a lever down to press the carb/petrol tickler button. The Jawa needed exactly the right amount of tickling, but if done while the engine was not turning, it instantly flooded, so you needed one person in the car, and another beside it working the air and petrol controls. With my mods I could do it alone, setting the air, then turning on the starter motor, spin engine one or two times, then tickle briefly about every 2 revs. With that system I could guarantee to start it in seconds, AND re-start it on the SAME DAY! ON MY OWN! That made the Velorex actually useable, once I had learned the exact procedure.

[Bob Purton]

I believe Solyto were made by Newmap, interested to know the KV connection.

[Big Al]

As opposed to the New Mapsolyto which is what I first thought it was called. Well I am dyslexic and that is how people pronounce it. So what was a Mapsolyto before they made a New one. Good name for a sat nav product though. I am certain there was a connection with some other car with KV but the grey cells have got lost in two stroke smoke.
There is nothing like tickling and choking your Velorex in public! I wanted to cover it in clear plastic so it was a see through car. Great for speeding as there would be a picture of a guy with an engine up his 'arris and a load of old heating tube scattered round him. Registration in the name of Barry Bucknell - there that dates me.

[mharrell]

I believe Solyto were made by Newmap, interested to know the KV connection.

Oops, Bob made the mistake of expressing interest!  Here's what I've pieced together so far:

KV Mini 1 production from 1970 to 1984 seems to be the general consensus.  I suspect the only person who can give a definitive answer is Gerald Garcia as he has the original factory records.  He is one of the founders of a club devoted to New Map motorcycles, predecessors of the KV:

http://motos.anciennes.free.fr/newmap.html

The company started as a machine shop in 1898 and began making motorcycles in 1924.  It was known as New Map at that time, though whether that name dates from 1898 or 1924 is not clear from what I've seen.  New Map produced the Solyto from the mid-1950s to the early 1970s.  The company merged with a manufacturer of telephone equipment in the 1960s and became KV (or the telephone company was already KV, again I'm not sure).  This accounts for the full name, Les Equipements Electriques KV, which otherwise would be odd in that the company never made an electric car.  Joseph Spalek, later the owner of the company and the "S" in KVS, constructed a prototype called the KV Mini around 1966 which looked very little like the later production vehicles.  Stunningly, Michiel van Ginkel has built a replica of this prototype; it's the green car shown towards the bottom of this thread:

http://www.autoweek.nl/forum/read.php?18,4066610,4067455

KV Mini 1 production started in 1970, though I've seen at least one reference to a 1969 vehicle which appears to be a misinterpretation of the significance of the "69" in its license plate which refers to the French department of Rhone, not a year.  Spalek took control of the company in the late 1970s (I've seen quotes of 1976 and 1978) and eventually changed its name and the name of the vehicles to KVS, but the date of the changeover is unclear and may not have been simultaneous for all lines of vehicles.  Mini 1 production most likely halted in 1984, but there seems to be confusion due to the identical body of its smaller-engined (nominally 50cc) sibling called the KV (or KVS) Gad'Jet and the similar name of the otherwise quite different KVS Mini 2. Neither of these models made use of the oh-so-endearing roller drive of the Mini 1, however.  These others may have been produced for a few years after the Mini 1 but it seems that car production may have halted altogether in 1986, followed by the company going out of business in 1989.  A warehouse full of unsold vehicles apparently continued to feed the market for several years after that, though.  I'm also not at all sure whether the oft-quoted production figure of approximately 2000 refers just to the Mini 1 or to the combined production of the Mini 1, Gad'Jet, and Mini 2.  The fact that my 1980 car bears serial number 976 suggests it may be the latter.  Again, Gerald Garcia may be able to sort all of this out, but his interest is almost entirely in New Map motorcycles.

If you want to experience some of the joy of attempting to do research on a company that went through the perversely generic names of New Map, KV, and KVS, here are a few other starting points, though they do contradict one another in places:

http://gazoline.net/article.pcgi?id_article=390

http://www.newmap.nl/

http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/K.V._Mini_1

[mharrell]

Oh I was being silly and vague, I knew at once what it is, hence the exclamation mark! I can hardly see the other sticker though, let alone make out what it is. Hope you can source more rollers.

Not to worry-- same here on the "silly and vague" part.  In reviewing the video I now see the dash badge is too small for identification.  It's from this group:

http://www.accf.com/main-us.htm

though it's an early badge made before they changed their name from "...CARS..." to "...CAR...."

[Bob Purton]

Thats a very comprehensive answer to a very short question! What make of engine does your KV have? Newmap used Ydral in there motorcycles at one time and that was really where my interest lies.

[mharrell]

What make of engine does your KV have? Newmap used Ydral in there motorcycles at one time and that was really where my interest lies.

The company made its own engines for the Mini 1.  I've been told that the piston, cylinder, and a few other components (connecting rod? head?) were purchased from a major manufacturer who is still in business (I probably should track down that reference...), but the block, crankshaft, and quite a bit else is unique.  The carburetor is a Bing type 21/20/108.

[mharrell]

The official video from the meet is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebJyLxAb3F4

Please keep in mind this was a micro- AND mini-car show before giving us Pacific Northwesterners too much grief over some of the larger entries.  Various philosophies of auto transport are illustrated at 9:04-9:25, followed by some guy in a green box attempting to mow the lawn without first affixing a blade.