Author Topic: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?  (Read 12230 times)

Jonathan Poll

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Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« on: December 05, 2010, 10:02:03 AM »
Hello,

  On the internet, I keep seeing that Nobel's where made in 1958, but my car was first registered in 1959, and it is the 17th made, so it was probably made in the first week or day of the production. My car was registered in June 1959 for the first time, so does that mean that Nobel made a few cars, waited half a year and made another batch?
Also, I heard that no-one knows where the factory was. Is this the adress? I doubt it but you never know...
http://nobel200.weebly.com/uploads/4/1/3/9/4139669/5607917_orig.jpg

  I have a picture of the reg document here:
« Last Edit: December 05, 2010, 10:04:02 AM by JonathanPoll »
Cars: Messerschmitt KR200, Nobel 200
Mopeds:
- Peugeot BB3SP, BB3T, BB3 "BITZA", BB VT, BB104,  TSA, Bima Luxe,
- Motobecane: 50V, M7 SL, 51 Club, EV50
- Other mopeds: Malaguti Superquattro, Solex 2200, Puch Monza, Puch Maxi

Chris Thomas

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2010, 11:52:10 AM »
Dear Jonathan

It is very interesting to look at this type of document.

Firstly it says the Nobel was first regisered on 3 June 1959, but could have sat in a show room for a year before being sold. The first models were normally sent out to dealers to drum up business.

Secondly this is a duplicate log book and is stamped 28 April 1971. Therefore the Right Honerable John Prescott (Labour) may not have been the first owner but the last recorded owner in 1971.

A semi detached house on a council housing estate is not likely to be the birth place of the Nobel.

The early development work on the nobel was done in the centre of London just off Piccadilly at the executive car hire firm garage run by the forunners of Ryan Air where the design was influenced by a Messerschmitt owned by Nobel (hence the engine). So it is more likely that production would have been in the London and home counties area rather than Cheshire.

I do hope this helps to shed light on the vehicles history.

Chris Thomas

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2010, 12:08:13 PM »
Woolly unresearched brain power comes up with - Chassis was Harland and Wolff wasn't it. Something about shells at Bristol. Engine from Sachs as many Fulda licenses were. Underpinnings as common to other licenced production suggesting a central producer - Fulda selling a kit of bits? The componants would have met at a production line rather than a manufacturer therefore. The excess were buried under a road, A17 was it. So the burial would be near the production facility.

Big Al
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
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richard

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2010, 12:11:52 PM »
and to think ! old two jags prescott started off  with a Nobel . that was before he was ENOBLED  :D ;D
outside of a dog a book is mans best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read .Groucho Marx 1895-1977

Jonathan Poll

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2010, 12:53:50 PM »
and to think ! old two jags prescott started off  with a Nobel . that was before he was ENOBLED  :D ;D

I doubt it was the deputy PM who owned my car, otherwise my car would be worth a tad bit more ;)
Thanks all of you, I didnt think of the showromm idea.

  - Jonathan -
Cars: Messerschmitt KR200, Nobel 200
Mopeds:
- Peugeot BB3SP, BB3T, BB3 "BITZA", BB VT, BB104,  TSA, Bima Luxe,
- Motobecane: 50V, M7 SL, 51 Club, EV50
- Other mopeds: Malaguti Superquattro, Solex 2200, Puch Monza, Puch Maxi

marcus

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #5 on: December 05, 2010, 01:09:28 PM »
It probably was not the Ex Hon J Prescott, but it may have been the great pie eater. Stella Rimmington, a former head of MI5 got her first new car soon after starting work as a spook's secretary. What did she buy? A red Heinkel Kabine. And she said she loved it.
Just remember: as one door closes behind you, another slams in your face

Bob Purton

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2010, 02:07:23 PM »
Were not the cars made in Newtownsard Nothern Ireland? Bodies made by Bristol and shipped over?

Jonathan Poll

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2010, 03:07:48 PM »
Were not the cars made in Newtownsard Nothern Ireland? Bodies made by Bristol and shipped over?

Hey Bob,

  Why not post more pics of your nobel? I'm half way taking the dashboard of of mine ( well having a break obviously now lol ) I hazve the places they where made here: http://nobel200.weebly.com/nobel-200.html
Cars: Messerschmitt KR200, Nobel 200
Mopeds:
- Peugeot BB3SP, BB3T, BB3 "BITZA", BB VT, BB104,  TSA, Bima Luxe,
- Motobecane: 50V, M7 SL, 51 Club, EV50
- Other mopeds: Malaguti Superquattro, Solex 2200, Puch Monza, Puch Maxi

blob

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2010, 07:32:18 PM »
Early press photos and brochures touting the British Nobel 200 actually show German Fuldamobils. So if 1958 is mentioned as the initial point of manufacture it probably wasn't produced in this country till later. Microcar manufacturers of the 50's were renown for their use of disinformation.

Chris Thomas

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #9 on: December 05, 2010, 08:16:31 PM »
Dear All

Looking at the chassis plate the adress is giben as London W1 which is the area around Piccadilly where the initial development work was done. Perhaps they were assembled in the garage workshop in W1. Note the Ryan air connection with Irish Harland and Wolf.

With components coming from different suppliers they could have been made in a small garage workshop almost anywhere.

I was only joking about the Right Honarable gentleman. I do not think he would ever have lived in Cheashire.

Chris Thomas

marcus

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #10 on: December 05, 2010, 08:26:15 PM »
The Shorts aircraft company based at Rochester, Kent also made some of its large flying boats, like Sunderlands in part of the Harland and Wolf dockyard, particularly during WW2. By 1958 this part would have been barely operating, so this could be the area where Nobels were worked on, the rest of the ship yard still being busy.
Just remember: as one door closes behind you, another slams in your face

Jonathan Poll

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #11 on: December 05, 2010, 09:05:36 PM »
Dear All

Looking at the chassis plate the adress is giben as London W1 which is the area around Piccadilly where the initial development work was done. Perhaps they were assembled in the garage workshop in W1. Note the Ryan air connection with Irish Harland and Wolf.

With components coming from different suppliers they could have been made in a small garage workshop almost anywhere.

I was only joking about the Right Honarable gentleman. I do not think he would ever have lived in Cheashire.

Chris Thomas


The nobel factory was a giant place, here are some pics I put on facebook:

Cars: Messerschmitt KR200, Nobel 200
Mopeds:
- Peugeot BB3SP, BB3T, BB3 "BITZA", BB VT, BB104,  TSA, Bima Luxe,
- Motobecane: 50V, M7 SL, 51 Club, EV50
- Other mopeds: Malaguti Superquattro, Solex 2200, Puch Monza, Puch Maxi

Chris Thomas

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #12 on: December 05, 2010, 09:22:13 PM »
Dear Jonathan

My contact tells me the workshop in London W1 where the York Nobel was worked on was  the top floor of a multy story car park  in Babmaes Street, off Jermyn Street in London, which is technically SW1 and not W1 which is the otherside of Piccadilly.

He says the cars were not made there but cars were serviced there. Noble himself would visit regularly but did not arrive by car but walked in, as if his office was not far away. It could be that there was another workshop near by. I will show my contact the photo of the factory where they were assembled to see if it is the same place.

Hopefully more news next week.

Chris Thomas

Chris Thomas

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #13 on: December 05, 2010, 09:29:59 PM »
Dear Jonathan

I have just done a google search and come up with this link

http://www.bbc.co.uk/northernireland/yourplaceandmine/belfast/A1067988.shtml

Which says that they were built in the Shorts Factory in Newtonards, N Ireland.

So what with Heinkels made in Dundalk and Nobel's made in Newtonards, What other microcars were mode in Ireland?

Chris Thomas

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Re: Are Nobel's 1958 or 1959 ?
« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2010, 09:32:41 PM »
Wow, I was right: the Belfast part of Shorts was called was called Harland and Shorts.
Just remember: as one door closes behind you, another slams in your face