Author Topic: Villiers 9e rebuild.  (Read 7549 times)

Bob Purton

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Villiers 9e rebuild.
« on: October 08, 2012, 09:00:24 pm »
Hi all. 9E crank shaft bearings, both roller and ball, are they standard clearance or C3?  Thanks in advance.

Bob Purton

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Re: Villiers 9e rebuild.
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2012, 06:24:11 pm »
More 9e questions. I noticed when I split the crank cases that there was no gasket, does anyone know if this is how it should be? Come on you Bond/Scootacar/Frisky owners,I know there are a lot of armchair enthusiasts on the forum but surely I cant be the only one that takes engines apart!???

Rusty Chrome (Malcolm Parker)

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Re: Villiers 9e rebuild.
« Reply #2 on: October 10, 2012, 12:06:31 am »
I haven't actually got as far as putting all the bits of engines I got with mine back together, but the information I have suggests there could be anything up to four gaskets between the engine crank case and gearbox to set the primary chain tension, but no gasket between the engine crankcases. This joint should be be very snug and sealed with a minimal smear of Hylomar Blue or similar. The Villiers manual says the crank bearings should be 6304 3 spot which is equivalent to C3 as far as I know.
Malcolm
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Big Al

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Re: Villiers 9e rebuild.
« Reply #3 on: October 10, 2012, 08:06:35 am »
I would fit C3, why wouldn't you? That is the basic known narrow tolerance fit isn't it? Anything less is going to have a greater variance in play than you would want on a mechanically meshed shaft. Might do for a wheel bearing but not in an engine. I know you can have to tight a tolerance as well as Mick had some mains that seized up due to the temperature he was running a bearing designed for some bit of aeroplane that presumably worked cold. If they are standard bearing C3 is not normally that expensive, save a few known club sources........

Not pulled a Villiers apart. Heinkel has no central gasket. Sachs has paper smeared with grease. Goggo, no gasket. So it would be no surprise if there is no or minimal material there. The outer, thinner castings need gaskets as they are not nearly as rigid as the inner crankcases which pull together before anything else is fitted anyway, so forming a unified oil tight casing.
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
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Bob Purton

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Re: Villiers 9e rebuild.
« Reply #4 on: October 10, 2012, 08:55:07 am »
Hi Al. Glad to get comment from a dirt under the finger nails guy like myself. Well as I understand it the C3 rated bearing is loose compared to the standard tolerance one because when the inner race is an interference fit to the crankshaft the heat transfer will close up a fair bit of the play. The dilemma is that we are told to replace like with like and not needlessly replace a standard one with C3 but as the old bearings are not marked with this rating how are we to know? So far I have rebuilt a lot of motorcycle engines, mostly Italian and normal bearings have given me no trouble what so ever, mind you they are all four strokes so the oil would have a cooling effect. Re the casings gasket, again all the motors I have rebuilt to this point have had a gasket[schmitt included]  so it came as a surprise to find it absent, thanks for pointing out that as Tom Jones would say" its not unusual" . I still will not be able to resist applying at least a smear of wellseal. That reminds me of a chat I had with a mechanic up at Duxford last year, I asked him if it was true that the Merlin as used in there Spitfire had no head gasket to which he replied yes but seventy year old ones appreciate a dollup of Wellseal!

Ahh Rusty Chrome, just spotted your post, that answers both questions. Many thanks indeed! 
« Last Edit: October 10, 2012, 08:59:03 am by Bob Purton »

Bob Purton

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Re: Villiers 9e rebuild.
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2012, 03:02:06 pm »
Just thought I would mention that I had a small crankshaft workshop in Essex press a new conrod /bigend assembly together for me, I got the conrod kit from Villiers services and got these folk to fit and true up the unit. I had already popped it apart on my own press out of curiosity but not having vee blocks thought better to have it fitted and trued by the professionals.  They charged me 25 plus vat and did an A1 job, I thought that was reasonable. Here is a link for the company  http://www.applebee.co.uk/index.html   Whilst chatting with Chris he mentioned that he does all Bromley Bubble[Dave Tadmans ] Isetta crank rebuilds. Its a small world!
« Last Edit: October 22, 2012, 03:06:31 pm by Bob Purton »

Barry

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Re: Villiers 9e rebuild.
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2012, 03:25:01 pm »
Perhaps we need another place on the forum to list recommended suppliers & services?

Big Al

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Re: Villiers 9e rebuild.
« Reply #7 on: October 22, 2012, 07:01:49 pm »
All a bit cheaper than official Sachs circles.
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
Citroen BX 17TZD & GTI 16v
Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs