Thinking of modifying your engine?

[Barry]

Copy from Scooter contacts.

Doug Catweasel
Well.. I have received an e-mail from MAG that is very long and complex, but for your pleasure I have read through it and basically it says that the legislation on type approval has been voted FOR by a massive majority of MEP's (the un-elected ones that are supposed to represent you). Without a scrap of evidence to prove that the new type-approval laws for bikes will prevent accidents or protect the environment, and failing to answer the scrutiny of the European Ombudsman, they voted for the new law even though most of the MEP's wouldn't have had time to study it properly or object. In short they just signed the document so they could go home and count there latest allowances. Here's the bit you REALLY need to know; The legislation which will outlaw ANY modification of ANY part of the power-train (anything between the air-filter and the end of the exhaust pipe) on any powered two-wheeler... wait for it... BELOW 48 hp, that's just about every scooter we ride. So any larger than life motorcycle will not be affected. So it looks like the baseball bat of legislation has swung round to smack US in the face. In short, a load of self-appointed, badly informed dictators in another country have just shot the British scooter scene through the head because their dinner was getting cold.

On the other hand, if you don't mind riding a bog standard scooter that you're not allowed to fiddle with and that you have to take to a garage to have the spark plug cleaned, you're okay.

One last thing, the company who carried out the 'research' just happens to be the same one that will make an obscene amount of money out of the whole scandal.

So, who wants to stay in Europe?

[Big Al]

Pardon? Unaware of this story. However it sounds about right and such legislation will be coming to a car near you. We are destined to become drones who pay tax for a huge raft of people to shuffle things about or do nothing at all. Shut up and do what your told. That Scottish Island beckons.

[Bob Purton]

How much do you want for your Lambretta Barry?

[Bob Purton]

BY the sound of this report  http://www.roadsafetygb.org.uk/news/2383.html    its going to apply to cars as well!

[Rob Dobie]

It's about time we (Britain) got out of the EU. We are an island after all. Cost a fortune to be in it! Why should they tell us how to run our country. They even drive on the wrong side of the road. 

[Barry]

How much do you want for your Lambretta Barry?

Perhaps this new wonderful European Directive of which we are all so fond may be from now - on?  How would they be able to tell if your engine had been modified before or after the law comes into force - if it does.
The only time they will find out is when you come off at 90mph on your Puch MS50D (how far into a cabbage field would that be? You could argue that the mud was particularly slippery and prevented your newly acquired twin front hydraulic discs from working properly.

So my Lambretta is safe perhaps?  It's only been increased from 6hp to about 20 and you would have to be an expert to recognise the loud induction roar and 120 decibel exhaust note.  Apart from that and 9,000 revs it appears pretty much standard.
In any case, most Lambrettas will do 90mph on a slight down hill stretch.

[Barry]

It's about time we (Britain) got out of the EU. We are an island after all. Cost a fortune to be in it! Why should they tell us how to run our country. They even drive on the wrong side of the road.  

You forget that if we came out of the EU, all of the migrant European workers would have to go home.  We would have to get our English. Irish and Welsh (not British because Scotland would stay in) unemployed to do the work.  Then there would be no work for the thousands working in the benefits office, translation departments, immigration offices etc.  It would be terrible.  There would be no need to build more schools, hospitals, thousands of houses on green belt etc.  No need to build more power stations or biomass incinerators or wind farms in the countryside (away from politicians houses).  The roads would become uncongested as the population decreased and there would be no need to build new ones.  It would be terrible.  Whats more, we could control our own policies on human rights which might result in poor victimised terrorists being deported to face a slapped wrist.  That would be just so unfair.

And then I woke-up.  It had all been a dream.................

[Big Al]

Certainly pulling out would be a chance to revise our welfare state etc to a more affordable and sensible footing. As I have said before, we are sat on fuel, surrounded by 200 miles of bountiful seas if used sensibly and need to return to our successful manufacturing of quality products not available elsewhere. Our farming can be returned to growing produce rather than be paid to intervene on behalf of investment interests or not produce at all. Given a sensible population level we are blessed. The EEC is no different to Napoleonic economic policy to defeat our trading dominance. We fought a big war to resolve that, then. This time we gave it away with nary a whimper. Let Europe go bust, interestingly the main reason France started the Napoleonic punch up, and lets get back to trading with the world without interference.

I particularly look forward to buying up the cheap unroadworthy left hand drive modified European cars. I am sure they would export to the cash rich in the rest of the world. Better than Bruce's Auction?

Enoch Hitchcock, has a bit of a ring to it.

[Rusty Chrome (Malcolm Parker)]

Well, I don't run a business, but when the CBI President said a couple of days ago, “Europe is the bedrock of our international trade. It should be viewed as the launch-pad from which our global trade can expand – not the landmass from which we retreat." and "it is essential that the voice of British business is loud and clear in extolling the virtues of future engagement. Not as a reluctant participant but as the lynchpin of our wider global trade ambitions.”,  I think you have to ask who is kidding who.

Working with disabled students as I do might also make you slightly less naive about the reality of cuts to the "welfare state" that are going on under your nose, watch this report from the BBC today and make sure your BUPA payments are up to date because this is the reality of what moving things to what you describe as a more "sensible footing" means for a growing number of people.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-20472169

The press release from the BMF about type approval is here.

http://www.righttoride.eu/?p=10559

and their briefing on what the legislation was actually setting out to do.

http://www.bmf.co.uk/pages/briefing_room_archive.php?fullstory=1073

and what was actually being proposed about anti-tampering -

ANTI-TAMPERING (Article 18)
This proposal contains a DA on anti-tampering. Although we are not in favour of this and have concerns about what future DAs contain, it is important to get the facts in proportion.

We already have anti-tampering measures on small restricted motorcycles (up to 125cc). These measure are supposed to make it difficult for restricted licence holders to change some components and easier for authorities to spot when some components have been changed. Examples include the marking of ECUs and using shear bolts on exhaust headers. It is not, however, illegal to change components and the new regulation will not make it illegal either. In fact as a full licence holder, it will be perfectly legal for you to buy a moped and tune it up as much as you like. Malcolm Harbour MEP told us “There is no intention by the EU institutions to prevent full-licence holders from modifying their vehicles or to extend anti-tampering to currently unrestricted machines.”

There is also nothing to suggest that tougher measures will be introduced and a Transport Research Laboratory (TRL) study failed to come up with any new suggestions on how to prevent tampering.

Finally, the EU isn't a bunch of self-appointed dictators , its an economic and political union that works in partnership with the elected governments of the EU states. MEPs are the ones democratically elected to make law and develop policies for the EU in partnership with the elected governments of the EU states.

[wilksie]

So, who wants to stay in Europe?

I do, but let's keep politics out of this.
Especially as there are French, German, US American, and other interested parties contributing to this thread.

[Jonathan Poll]

Copy from Scooter contacts.

Doug Catweasel
Well.. I have received an e-mail from MAG that is very long and complex, but for your pleasure I have read through it and basically it says that the legislation on type approval has been voted FOR by a massive majority of MEP's (the un-elected ones that are supposed to represent you). Without a scrap of evidence to prove that the new type-approval laws for bikes will prevent accidents or protect the environment, and failing to answer the scrutiny of the European Ombudsman, they voted for the new law even though most of the MEP's wouldn't have had time to study it properly or object. In short they just signed the document so they could go home and count there latest allowances. Here's the bit you REALLY need to know; The legislation which will outlaw ANY modification of ANY part of the power-train (anything between the air-filter and the end of the exhaust pipe) on any powered two-wheeler... wait for it... BELOW 48 hp, that's just about every scooter we ride. So any larger than life motorcycle will not be affected. So it looks like the baseball bat of legislation has swung round to smack US in the face. In short, a load of self-appointed, badly informed dictators in another country have just shot the British scooter scene through the head because their dinner was getting cold.

On the other hand, if you don't mind riding a bog standard scooter that you're not allowed to fiddle with and that you have to take to a garage to have the spark plug cleaned, you're okay.

One last thing, the company who carried out the 'research' just happens to be the same one that will make an obscene amount of money out of the whole scandal.

So, who wants to stay in Europe?

Thats crazy...

Funny you say going to the garage for a spark plug chagne, I went to see one of my friends, who is my age, and his grandfather, who loves old cars (he used to have a 3 wheeler Morgan, and nearly bought an old Bugatti!). His grandfather had the job of fixing up my friends scooter (modern thing). He said he had to buy a special tool just for the spark plug!

That's why I prefer my type of "toys": easy to run, easy to fix!

JP

[Big Al]

So, who wants to stay in Europe?

I do, but let's keep politics out of this.
Especially as there are French, German, US American, and other interested parties contributing to this thread.

Agreed as folk make assumptions as to what a statement like 'sensible footing' might mean and off we go on a complex and unanswerable topic without a correct solution. The EEC was a great concept but it is being managed rather badly and needs to buck up its ideas.

Certainly the SVA test, or what ever it is called, has reached the point where it is almost impossible to get registration for an accurate copy of something like an AC Cobra. I fail to understand having a Cobra replica with modern bits on it. Its like an ugly women with loads of make up on it. You do not want to take it home and wake up to it in the morning.
As it happens I think that is a good thing SVA prevents lots of replicas as those genuine cars that survive deserve their status as something special. On the flip side Morgan decided to re introduce the Trike. They seem to have managed to take the essence of the old and renewed it reasonably successfully and the thing stands by its own merits. You have a choice, now, of new or old. If a small manufacturer can do that why cannot a large one? Probably because they do not want to. A few attempts have been made but were not too successful as I fear the management could not really see what was trying to be created and interfered. Two seat repro sports cars with four seats being a classic error of judgement.

[Chris Thomas]

Reading through the articles what strikes me is that this legislation is not retrospective. Ie it only applies to vehicles built after the legislation has beeen authorised.
Secondly the bulk of the legislation is there to keep restricted vehicles within the restrictions, such as mopeds doing no more than 30 mph, or San Permis vehicles with diesel engines with no more than 4 Kw power, and bodies no heavier than 350 kg.  Whilst none of us like the big brother of governments controling us, sometimes the media does spin things in a direction to sell more copy. It is the federation of British Historic Vehicles who lobbies the government on our behalf on such issues, and I am sure they will be reporting back to us soon if there are any serious issues.

Chris Thomas Rumcar news

[Bob Purton]

Ah the voice of reason!