Pre 1960 MOT exemption

[Bob Purton]

I'm curious to hear of anyone's experiences so far in taxing there pre 1960 cars with no MOT certificate. Has anyone done this yet? Any problems?

[richard]

I imagine that as your v5 states date first reg. And you fill in the form ticking the box for exemption there should be no problems . After all the list of vehicles previously exempted was already quite long . Equally interested though .

[Big Al]

Great until the system has incorrect records or a bad bit of programming. Or is operated by lazy spot bots.

Little story. This after crashed car would appear to have had a valid tax disc cashed in by a DVLA operative in a scam. She got this money back.

Chum gets new replacement car. Car has new engine fitted as part of the deal.  V5C sent to be changed while tax etc running as Insurers want matching docs before use as to many tuned and other issues on changed engines these days. Simple hey!
Wait.
Wait.
Call Swansea, 'in the system'.
Wait.
Call Swansea, 'in the system'.
Wait.
Call Swansea, 'it is not in the system'. Great!
Download stuff to re apply - thinks, can they not priorities as this has now cost a months motoring at a 12th tax disc, 12th insurance and all the cost and hassle of trying to live without a car having bought one, got it register for blue disc parking, bla bla..
'No, cannot do that, Madam. What was the number of the car, I will double check. Oh, it comes up as having been processed and the new book sent out on the 6th'. 'Why was I told there was no record yesterday'?
'Oh I expect the chap wanted to get home or something'.
'Where did the V5C go to'?
'Just a mo - edit - the people that sold you the car (that had moved by then)'.
'Why'?
'Because they were on the V5C as the owners'.
'No they were not'.
'Well is just a mistake'.
'Well clearly, but one that has now cost me in the region of £300.......
No restitution. Answer, if DVLA cost you money I think we should all send in invoices as a matter of course to cover the costs we have incurred due to their continueing incompetence. They might rethink removing the LVO's as a double check then. The very reason DVLA do not like them as the LVO spend half there time sorting out DVLA muck ups. I am told that up to a third of V5C's carry incorrect information yet we are fast become reliant on this very system for our entire car management structure. It clearly is an unsupportable management tool for the task and it is failing under the strain. The Government has no money to invest in a better one, allegedly. Of course that is rubbish as its is as much about control with out responsibility as it is about politics. I think that is a reason why tax free old cars have popped out the side as putting in old the old rules etc etc is just to complicated.

[golo2]

Hello strangers, long time no speak -have had a period of loss of spark---mostly schmitt related with some isetta stuff thrown in for good measure. Still it was suggested by long time fan that I keep the faith! so with added faith a contribution

My schmitt (the one that broke down taking daughter to her wedding) was on SORN. It has always Been insured -the (a)greed amount has put me off driving it.
SORN renewal arrived and I had recently renewed the insurance due to end 30 April 2013, new start 1 May 2013 for a year. Online kept telling me not insured as I asked for Tax start 1 May. Phoned Hagerty very helpful said DVLA do not update their database frequently usually waiting until a few days before end/start of month and to go to a post office
 To a post office I went with SORN document, insurance (both years and log book V5a?) unhelpful and ignorant post staff could not read/understand English and said if an MOT is written in the reminder it must have one. I asked him to read another paragraph opposite which clearly stated not needed if made befor Jan 1 1960  All to no avail no wonder the post service is so --ap more like post poor service!
Set to with online again
1. Tick yes to all first set of questions -even the one that asks for appropriate MOT (the appropriateness is not needed!)
2. Choose month with known insurance from April for me
3. computer says  YES
within a few days tax disc arrived so can trouble shoot the schmitt  up and down the road apparently legally. Unless an expert from this group tells me otherwise?

[Bob Purton]

Oh dear! I bet you were popular with your daughter!
I guess you should have used the isetta instead, much more reliable! [I'm bias!]

Thanks for this though, just the kind of input I was looking for. So you actually faired better with a machine rather than a person! Its usually the other way around. I originally posed this question because I have a 1959 car which has been off the road for many years, it has the latest V5 document and I was wondering what response I was going to get at the post office equipped with my V5, insurance certificate and no MOT and of course no renewal document. We shall see.

[Big Al]

I guess you should have used the isetta instead, much more reliable! [I'm bias!]

Yes an Isetta wins. You can predict when it will go wrong. Where as a Schmitt has that random two stroke effect that means you find such interesting people and nice places further from home.

Not really able to help Ian. In the middle of moving etc etc. Unlikely to be free till autumn. However once Longcot is set up then it should become a drop in centre for local classic car folk.

[Bob Purton]

Dont take on so Al. Its a joke, my Schmitt only ever broke down once with a blocked fuel filter before I cleaned out and sealed the tank so I guess that was my fault, mind you neither of my Isettas have ever conk out at all.   I know, just give it time!

[Big Al]

The most unreliable micro I had was a Berkeley T60. Even when it 'worked' it would not start without sniffing a combustible first. The wheel fell off. The electrics continually failed despite my Kit car trick of putting a copper earth front to rear via battery and engine. Etc Etc. They are really not very good cars when worn out. Before anyone says it this was when such a car was worth about £200, so no, you did not consider rebuilding it but which hedge to loose it in if it conked right out!

[Bob Purton]

I take back what I said the other day about Isetta reliability! I got the car out of storage yesterday and had a very bad trip home with it, it kept cutting out and when it was running it wouldnt idle. The problems were solved with a good carb cleaning exercise later that afternoon. The non idling prob was the rubber choke plunger tip having become dislodge and not seating correctly, I've had this before so knew what to look for. I also took advice on the fuel line run, apparently if it runs down and then up again to the carb its prone to air locks, I also learned that there are no baffles in the tank which can compound the problem. I wonder if a foam tank bladder as used in racing cars would help with this, I have one in the tank I'm using in the top secret project and it doesnt appear to reduce the capacity by much at all. Another thing I noticed was that my points had closed up somewhat, after resetting them the car drives a lot perkier. It pass the begrudged MOT this morning so me and MIke Plant are all set for the Supercar event at Malden tomorrow. I have a list of entrants and there will be some really early cars there from 1902 in fact. Much more interesting as I fear the supercars will just be "tarts handbags"!   Is anyone else planning to attend?

[Big Al]

No, Bob, me straps broke and me supercars bits are all over the floor. Ooh Ah!

Choke plunger, regular little playpal after none use. Not sure that constitutes a break down, more of a fettling to get going.

Redirecting the fuel line can do no harm. Not always possible in these cars but a straight unhindered down hill run is best, especially if the pipe is likely to get hot. I thought the Isetta had a filter bowl to even out delivery by having a small reserve. The schmitt has a filter on the tap with a small reserve but the Trienkel lives without one. Both have baffled tanks. The Schmitt does respond to correct fuel line rooting and debate continues on this and if armoured fuel pipe is good. I do not use armoured pipe as I think it serves to warm the fuel on a long run. I use a clip on the rear mid engine bolt and go under the carb with just enough pipe to allow the boot to open. With fuel more volatile than off old every little advantage is needed to stop vaporization in the fuel line.

[Bob Purton]

Strap broke? Ay least you can still dance around it at the disco!

I did shorten the fuel line yesterday by about an inch which has improved the run and taken the U shape out of it. I have often thought how the lack of tank baffles effects the fuel flow on roundabouts when there is a fuel bowl but its a fact, it does. Maybe it creates a momentery vacuum and pulls the fuel back up the pipe for a moment untill the vent in the cap releases it?  Who knows. The solution is to keep the tank topped up.

Re schmitts, I often wondered why they didnt leave the tank out of the lid like the KR175. That would solve the fuel line route prob and also allow you to test run the engine whilst tinkering. I guess there must be a down side which Al is just about to fire at my broadside!

[Big Al]

I think it was cheaper to fix it on the boot than make extra supports. It also clears the plug for extraction but an alternative design could have got round that. I often think about fitting a pump and having the fuel under the rear seat, in a sectioned off area. Lowers the centre of gravity and would resolve the vaporization prob to a major extent. The vacant space could be part used to make a far more effective induction tract.

[Bob Purton]

But would the bing needle float system be able to handle a pump?

[Big Al]

A low pressure one, yes. Quite a few Bing installations had vacuum pumps or even the odd mechanical and electric pumps. Goggo 250 transplants and Shopper, Tiger, Early Bing Prinz etc. The principle of the cone valve is the harder you push it the more tightly closed it becomes. That said a too high pressure could see the other joints fail as it was not designed with that in mind and a pump will keep pumping unless a cut off is put in so there is an increased risk of a fire. I imagine you could put a high pressure link in but it is not really needed. I have had a SU clone on a Berkeley with a tank in the rear. That was interesting as it was almost fuel injected at high speed.

[golo2]

Hagerty (Insurance) have made a statement about the no MOT position I will try and paste it here but if nothing appears try Hagerty site

http://www.hagertyinsurance.co.uk/Articles-and-Resources/All-Articles/2013/05/01/MoT-Changes?utm_source=ExactTarget&utm_medium=email&utm_term=&utm_content=&utm_campaign=Hagerty%20UK%20News

not sure but think its highlight  all the above and paste in browser menu
Apologies if it does not work! and help from those who know to sort it appreciated