Author Topic: Invacar model 70 parts question  (Read 4531 times)

Matt1

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Invacar model 70 parts question
« on: January 21, 2013, 12:46:45 PM »
Hi, I know it can be a touchy subject here, but can anyone tell me what front and rear brakes they use and also what cv joints are used?

Thanks
  Matt

Big Al

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2013, 01:04:35 PM »
The rear drive shaft is Fiat 126. Front and rear brakes are the same and standard Girling stuff found at autojumble for next to nothing.
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Matt1

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2013, 04:13:14 PM »
Thanks, does standard girling mean I can use mini drums?

Bob Purton

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2013, 05:15:47 PM »
Email the expert direct at       invacar@yahoo.co.uk

Matt1

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2013, 06:58:45 PM »
I will do.
Thanks

Big Al

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2013, 08:34:21 PM »
Oh dear!

Well the drums are not Mini. They are more akin to trailer 10 inch jobs and like a Reliant. These being lighter and thinner than a Mini. If you hit them hard with a hammer to loosen them they crack into bits! So do not hit them hard with a hammer. Makes it tricky to remove them if the shoes are jammed. I expect there are some in the massed ranks of the ex dealer spares in Suffolk.

The shoes and cylinders are bog standard but without looking up my parts book, which are in nadger reducing cold storage in a shed, I cannot quote the exact machines they are used on. At a guess I think the shoes are rear of Midget etc and the slaves are A40 but I am guessing. I just took samples to a jumble and for £27 I had three new cylinders and a set of shoes with two to spare as they come in fours. Deep joy.

Beware of the front studs. These are screwed in  and are not counterclockwise locked with a blob of weld on the reverse. They have a habit of failure and/or unwinding rather than the wheel nut. Crap design as you then get a wheel that is neither on nor off. The only way out is to remove the hub and get technical.

Replacing the 'CV' joint is also worth research. If Fiat, the drive shaft is tightened into the hub bearings using a sacrificial crush-able washer and not like a normal British taper bearings installation of tightened and backed off to a preset loading. Many a Fiat has got rear hub play/probs/damage as they are assembled incorrectly. I assume the Type 70 to use this method of fastening but I have yet to go in there myself. It might be that your problem is this not a CV issue. If you remove the hub stubaxle you will need to check the fitting type to tighten appropriately. (What is now Granville Taylor's Bianchina came to me with this, among several self inflicted probs, as a cheap trade in and was easily resolved after a swot up before I let the car go running very much better, seeing of all comers at Market Rasen after John Bannell and I rebuilt the dissy at Louth. I sold it a year or so later as it was not really me. Granville has continued to improve it and a brill little car it is).
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richard

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2013, 09:18:50 PM »
some people don't take a hint  :) i assume bob meant go away and discuss amongst yourselves  ;) i do apologise if i have bob wrong
« Last Edit: January 22, 2013, 01:50:09 PM by lightweight dickie »
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Barry

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2013, 09:38:34 PM »
Morris Minor repair kit suggested on Ebay for Invacar - I don't know.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/150538626134?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

I have two drums in my pile - don't know for sure if they are Invacar but they match my rear brake back-plate assembly.
I will compare them with the ones on a car tomorrow.

I have some Universal joint looking bits but they don't look exactly like what is on the car (in the snow).






Stuart Cyphus

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2013, 09:41:41 PM »
 Yes, the drive shafts should be pure Fiat, but bear in mind the Model 70's development goes way back into the time of the Fiat 500. Indeed, the early prototypes used the entire mechanics of a Fiat 500 as in hubs, radius arms, suspension, drive system, gearbox and engine. Production Model 70's have a unique gearbox mated to the flat-twin Styre-Puch engine, but this was originally fitted to a Fiat 500-based vehicle itself, so both ends of the driveshafts sound like they should be standard Fiat. As time went on and the 500 gave way to the 126, I would have expected the Model 70 to have followed as regards swap-over of parts if there is any difference between 500 & 126 in that department.

 Keep poking me on the hubs if I don't respond timely. I think I've got a list of certain parts used somewhere and what they were from, but I can't recall if it included brake drums. Again, historically, the Model 70 used 12-inch wheels up to around 1974-75 and then went down to 10-inch Mini rims thereafter, so that might be why the drums turn into something weird.

 If anyones got any at the moment, It'll be Barry!  ;)  

 Judging by the dates on the Morris Minor repair kit, I'd say it's for older, Villiers-engined cars (Stop looking Bob!) Plus, be careful of falling into the trap of calling ALL invalid three-wheelers "Invacars". The Repairers never did it (not proper ones anyway) so shouldn't we....
« Last Edit: January 22, 2013, 10:47:21 PM by Stuart Cyphus »

Big Al

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2013, 10:14:55 PM »
I think I forgot. The drums have larger stud holes to fit a shamfer on the wheel stud but snug enough to locate it. So that would not be as a Mini. Pics look OK.

Yes they could be Morris Minor. Effectively it has rear brakes all round. Now that could be improved on if one tuned things up but for the purposes it was deemed good enough. So no brake bias. The shoes have a sprung loaded pin to hold them in place and have an end expanding adjuster as you see in the picture. This again is a standard Girling etc part should it not be there or naff. You need a square adjusting spanner, ideally.

I would be surprised if the drive shaft is not 126 biased by this time. However in the interest of not spending money they could be some thing got as a clearout.
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Bob Purton

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2013, 12:07:27 AM »
"Villiers-engined cars (Stop looking Bob!) "      By pure coincidence tonight I spotted one of the speedo drives that I was just about to give you Stuart, the one I liberated from the dead Acedes, Sold on ebay for £80. Think I will keep it now! 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/281051540760?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

As already suggested Matt, Barry is probably your man for the spares these days known on this forum as Isetta owner.   

Stuart Cyphus

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #11 on: January 22, 2013, 10:39:44 PM »
UPDATE;  I've found my stack of Ministry paperwork, including the actual Master Parts List from Heywood Stores itself. There is no mention anywhere of what the brake drums are from, nor any useful parts list. All it says for brake components is "Mostly Girling, proceed with caution".

Big Al

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Re: Invacar model 70 parts question
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2013, 09:14:38 AM »
Speedo drives, especially ones that angle the direction, are good sellers on eBay. I am not sure why but I assume they are a classic lost part plus those who make up machines out of bits and bobs often find the need to direct the cable away from some rotating or oscillating gubbins. My collection sold for enough to buy a small microcar! Still got the MK1 Austin Healey rev counter drive assembly in case I ever get another Frogeve. Ridiculously expensive and nigh on always sold rogered on the sort of car I would buy.
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
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