Author Topic: Worst car in the World? !  (Read 11655 times)

marcus

  • Prolific Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 2676
    • http://marcusdemowbray.wordpress.com/
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #15 on: October 15, 2015, 07:11:02 PM »
^ Reminds me a bit of my old business partner's Oldsmobile Silhouette MPC, a car in which I was often a passenger but did sometimes drive, in the greater Dallas area in Texas. Not a bad car in most respects, but if you were trying to drop one or two people off it was a pig! You could NOT simply pull over and whoever wanted to get out then open the doors and leave, NO WAY!

"I cannot open the door"

"OK, I'll put it in neutral"

"I still cannot open the door"

"OK, I'll put on the hand brake"

"I s c o t d"

"OK, I'll turn the engine off"

"I s c o t d"

"OK I'll turn off the radio"

"I s c o t d"

"OK, I'll unplug my seatbelt"

........


"OK, I'll turn off the lights"

.....

"Ok, I'll turn off the air conditioning"

"Ah, NOW AT LAST I can get out!"


"What happens if we have a crash, the driver is dead and cannot switch things off and I need to get out of the burning car?"

"Apparently all safety locking systems should de-activate so that you can open the doors"

" 'SHOULD' ???? .....hmmmmmmm, I'm not entirely convinced!"

A really nasty car to be back seat passenger in: Vauxhall Astra (fast back model). I admit that I am exceptionally tall and fat*, so I cannot expect a HUGE amount of head and shoulder room, but that back seat is crazy! The top of my head touches the ceiling, the back window almost presses on the back of my head, the side "window" almost touches the side of my head and is too high up and far too narrow to see out of. The head restraints on the front seats mean that you have virtually no view out of any window. The hard "sporty" rear suspension is harder than a KR200 without the excuse of being a very basic runabout.

*    I am exceptionally tall and fat* please note the heavy sarcasm, I am a thin short-arse!



« Last Edit: October 15, 2015, 07:12:50 PM by marcus »
Just remember: as one door closes behind you, another slams in your face

1bubble10 (paul smith)

  • Quite Chatty
  • ****
  • Posts: 122
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #16 on: October 15, 2015, 08:32:28 PM »
Being the owner of a P50 copy I do think that the chinese quad components are the cars biggest enemy. The chinese Honda clone engine is only a clone in as much as the clothes its wears and what lies beneath are cheap inferior parts which shall never offer Honda reliability or durability. The quad front end steering set up is not great. anything above 30 miles per hour and the car is at great risk of leaving the road as the faster the speed, the harder it is to keep the vehicle travelling in a straight line. I cant compare it to an original as as I have never driven one - I have heard claims of speeds up to 40mph, and if this is true then the steering and suspension setup must be better than the quad set up.

Is it the worse car???

Some will say yes and others will say no.

For me - I did not buy this as serious transport or a replacement for any other vehicle. In fact if I was replacing a moped for the P50 then surely it could be considered as an improvement as it offers a level of protection from the elements - possibly a little less stable and just as vulnerable. If it happened to be a chinese moped then probably no worse mechanically. I bought the P50 for fun and attention. For those two reasons it scores highly. A nice toy to have and even tinkering with it (there has been a lot more of that than I could have expected and not yet finished either) is fun too!

P50 or Microcar Virgo?

I bought the Virgo as serious transport (so had expectations). The car was very weak, no fun and failed to deliver even as a town runabout!!!
Bamby P50, Piaggio Ape 50

1bubble10 (paul smith)

  • Quite Chatty
  • ****
  • Posts: 122
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #17 on: October 15, 2015, 08:54:16 PM »
I have a hate for any vehicle that has an ECU - I own two vehicles (at present) with ECU's but when they start to get unreliable/expensive to repair I shall replace them with older technology.

How will you do that then? ECU's are essential on modern engined cars, you just can't get the right air fuel ratios required for modern emissions, plus the driveability benefits.

ECU's are very rugged and reliable these days, because a lot of R & D went into ruggedising components so they stand up to the punishment out in the field. Goinf back to clockwork ignition and carbs is a real step backwards.

By getting a classic and using as everyday transport.

Its not just an ECU, it is all of the sensors and other rubbish that is part of the big equation in the name of saving the planet. It use to be rust that killed cars but now it is electronics. Modern cars are beyond the DIYer now and even ruling out some backstreet garages. Unless you can afford to invest in vehicle specific diagnostics you have no chance - but even the diagnostics does not reliably get it right. Even on a classic an intermittent electrical fault can be a challenge, on a modern vehicle it can amount to the end of its life. The next generation of vehicles shall need coding of components for replacement parts (this is to try to tackle the issue of vehicles being stolen to break for parts. This is good news for car insurers and bad new for the motorists pockets). You wont be able to even bolt a starter motor on with out hooking up to a computer - this will see the end of car breakers and second hand car parts. I needed to have a code installed on my smart car by mercedes the car would not accept it. They ended up having to wipe the ecu and reinstall back to factory default. Modern cars will never become tomorrow's classics - whan main dealer decides to pull the plug on supporting a certain model then the cars fate is written in stone.
Bamby P50, Piaggio Ape 50

Big Al

  • Prolific Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4578
  • Ranttweiler, biting the breeze block of banter
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2015, 08:26:44 AM »
ECU is indeed the flag of when cars become a liability to own. VW have rather proved the entire green agenda attached to these cars is total lies and rubbish, as I always said it was. It all comes down to quality. Be that design or construction and components. Made to high standards, with honesty, the ECU based cars sporned could function well. The fact is they do not, they are not as green as running an earlier car made well. Older Mercs were made to eat miles, and did. I would have one over one of these modern ludicrous and ugly machines being knocked out as a Merc now. However I do not need that level of performance.
So a MG Magnette or Borgward, offering the homely space, matched to a Pug XUD on a five speed gearbox and uprated corners offers all I, and really, most, people need as everyday transport. It will exceed the speed limits, so cruising at 'normal' speeds is no problem. (Normal speed that never should test the upper reaches of modern overpowered cars). It is pretty much infinity repairable if you certain key parts. A car for life. The Government in its infinite wisdom offers me cheaper motoring as a result.
Meanwhile your ECU will be counting the hours to its self destruction at a future time where you will carry the costs of repair, or scrappage for a new car, accelerating the eventual use of all of the earth's resources. Before we even get there, you will not get me to believe that chips in products are not programmed to die.
But then I still believe in minimalist motoring, of which what am doing is a form. I will retain several small cars to, the ones that really work as serious transport, even today. Modern cars are not about minimalism. They are about greed, and often driven accordingly.

Clubnight - 6 guys, 1 Nissan auto box failed. 1 Nissan based car boiled with out offering a warning. 1 Pug self destructed, no warning. 3 moderns scrapped in a month, as probs unspecified, and thus to expensive to commission. These are cars owned by folk who are well able to restore older cars from a pile of crude. No failed old cars, indeed one is in service while a new modern is found for the winter. Sorry, for me moderns are untouchable crap and appliances like fridges, not cars (Hey, that is what they used to call Invalid Carriages!).
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
Citroen BX 17TZD & GTI 16v
Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs

Big Al

  • Prolific Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4578
  • Ranttweiler, biting the breeze block of banter
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #19 on: October 16, 2015, 08:28:01 AM »
The worst car I ever drove was a Japanese people carrier we had at work one morning as a loan vehicle a couple of years ago which (as usual) I had about 2 minutes to try to acclimatise myself to before taking five students with ADHD and learning difficulties off to college and trying to make sure that they weren't late. Usually, I can master things like opening the doors quite quickly, but this flash new sparkling contraption with every extra under the sun had the optional electrically powered sliding doors for the passengers. Unfortunately, it was immediately obvious that they didn't work with the car remote. I did manage to get them open with the old-fashioned method of inserting the key into the lock on each side individually, but my passengers quickly found that once inside, they couldn't open them again. It took about 25 minutes wading through the seemingly 10000 page instruction manual before I managed to fathom out that it had been delivered with the child locks set on and with the electronic doors switched off and then to find out where that little childlock button was hidden (in the central consul above your head in-between the interior light switches with some very ambiguous symbol on it -obviously) and where the control for the electronic doors was - under the passenger seat - simple! Admittedly my impressions were probably coloured by the baying mob of students who were all fighting to help me open the doors with any mechanical implement they could find and who ended up catching the bus, but I think you can have too much sophistication. Give me a Ford Transit any day.

How do you get out after an accident?
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
Citroen BX 17TZD & GTI 16v
Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs

Rusty Chrome (Malcolm Parker)

  • Global Moderator
  • Prolific Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1221
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2015, 12:47:29 PM »
The worst car I ever drove was a Japanese people carrier we had at work one morning as a loan vehicle a couple of years ago which (as usual) I had about 2 minutes to try to acclimatise myself to before taking five students with ADHD and learning difficulties off to college and trying to make sure that they weren't late. Usually, I can master things like opening the doors quite quickly, but this flash new sparkling contraption with every extra under the sun had the optional electrically powered sliding doors for the passengers. Unfortunately, it was immediately obvious that they didn't work with the car remote. I did manage to get them open with the old-fashioned method of inserting the key into the lock on each side individually, but my passengers quickly found that once inside, they couldn't open them again. It took about 25 minutes wading through the seemingly 10000 page instruction manual before I managed to fathom out that it had been delivered with the child locks set on and with the electronic doors switched off and then to find out where that little childlock button was hidden (in the central consul above your head in-between the interior light switches with some very ambiguous symbol on it -obviously) and where the control for the electronic doors was - under the passenger seat - simple! Admittedly my impressions were probably coloured by the baying mob of students who were all fighting to help me open the doors with any mechanical implement they could find and who ended up catching the bus, but I think you can have too much sophistication. Give me a Ford Transit any day.

How do you get out after an accident?

I guess you have to take it back to the dealer.
Malcolm
Bond Mk D - "The Bond Minicar solves your problem"
Nobel 200 - "Almost as cheap as breathing!"

richard

  • Rich
  • Prolific Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4458
  • Bond ,Gordon,Bruetsch
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #21 on: October 16, 2015, 01:33:31 PM »
Untouchable crap Al ? That's a bit strong ! Maintenance charges are minimal ! Even with my sort of mileage just about two services a year , 20,000 interval . Yes you can't do anything yourself but you just don't have to ! My first company Cortina , if I remember correctly , first service 250 miles , 2nd 1000? And thereafter 2,500 miles ? In today's prices the servicing charges would have been much higher back then . Give me a modern.  Company :) , car anyday ! 
outside of a dog a book is mans best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read .Groucho Marx 1895-1977

Rob Dobie

  • Prolific Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 753
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #22 on: October 16, 2015, 02:41:48 PM »
You're darn lucky to get a free company car.  Reps? They seem to be the worst drivers around this way, most braking the speed limits and driving up your arse!
Ain't got nuffink now except memories.

Barry

  • Prolific Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1207
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #23 on: October 16, 2015, 04:08:41 PM »
You're darn lucky to get a free company car.  Reps? They seem to be the worst drivers around this way, most braking the speed limits and driving up your arse!
Cliff Richards Syndrome?

1bubble10 (paul smith)

  • Quite Chatty
  • ****
  • Posts: 122
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #24 on: October 16, 2015, 04:47:06 PM »
ECU is indeed the flag of when cars become a liability to own. VW have rather proved the entire green agenda attached to these cars is total lies and rubbish, as I always said it was. It all comes down to quality. Be that design or construction and components. Made to high standards, with honesty, the ECU based cars sporned could function well. The fact is they do not, they are not as green as running an earlier car made well. Older Mercs were made to eat miles, and did. I would have one over one of these modern ludicrous and ugly machines being knocked out as a Merc now. However I do not need that level of performance.
So a MG Magnette or Borgward, offering the homely space, matched to a Pug XUD on a five speed gearbox and uprated corners offers all I, and really, most, people need as everyday transport. It will exceed the speed limits, so cruising at 'normal' speeds is no problem. (Normal speed that never should test the upper reaches of modern overpowered cars). It is pretty much infinity repairable if you certain key parts. A car for life. The Government in its infinite wisdom offers me cheaper motoring as a result.
Meanwhile your ECU will be counting the hours to its self destruction at a future time where you will carry the costs of repair, or scrappage for a new car, accelerating the eventual use of all of the earth's resources. Before we even get there, you will not get me to believe that chips in products are not programmed to die.
But then I still believe in minimalist motoring, of which what am doing is a form. I will retain several small cars to, the ones that really work as serious transport, even today. Modern cars are not about minimalism. They are about greed, and often driven accordingly.

Clubnight - 6 guys, 1 Nissan auto box failed. 1 Nissan based car boiled with out offering a warning. 1 Pug self destructed, no warning. 3 moderns scrapped in a month, as probs unspecified, and thus to expensive to commission. These are cars owned by folk who are well able to restore older cars from a pile of crude. No failed old cars, indeed one is in service while a new modern is found for the winter. Sorry, for me moderns are untouchable crap and appliances like fridges, not cars (Hey, that is what they used to call Invalid Carriages!).

Could not have put it better myself!! :)
Bamby P50, Piaggio Ape 50

Chris Thomas

  • Administrator
  • Prolific Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1261
  • old Banana
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #25 on: October 16, 2015, 04:48:50 PM »
Cliff Richards Syndrome sounds very painful

Chris Thomas

Big Al

  • Prolific Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4578
  • Ranttweiler, biting the breeze block of banter
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #26 on: October 17, 2015, 08:00:51 AM »
You can add the Trooper to moderns downed by silly modern electrics this month. Both my plips have now failed so the car is inert, as I cannot set the alarm system on the ECU. Funny how both failed with 3 months of each other at 26 years old. Now a diesel is dead easy to make inert. It can be done with a hidden switch. No plip is needed, no brain is needed. But Mr Big-Willy has to have lots of light flashing and hoots for his expensive car.

Now because I bought a pre ECU vehicle the answer is surgery to remove this voluntarily fitted bit of junk, bin it, and get the machine none electrically dependant like any good and proper diesel should be! Bit later and this car would now probably be scrap as where do I get a plip without a load of cost and hassle? Besides when is it going to do it again? Might be in Mull or somewhere handy for home!

Company car, well it just is not your problem is it. Anyway your wearing the car out with miles covered not car parks parked in. But it is the way to use a modern.
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
Citroen BX 17TZD & GTI 16v
Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs

1bubble10 (paul smith)

  • Quite Chatty
  • ****
  • Posts: 122
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #27 on: October 17, 2015, 09:28:20 AM »
Don't think mileage is the main culprit for the failure of electronic components. Age plays a big part in the equation - so parked in a carpark the timer for self destruct is still ticking away. That's the car manufacturers way of getting older vehicles off the road to ensure a healthy demand for new vehicles.

Society has change from a repair and make do, to a throw away and replace culture - the economy would fall apart without it as it now depends on it to work. Think it is driven by manufacturers and encouraged by governments.
 
« Last Edit: October 17, 2015, 09:36:14 AM by 1bubble10 (paul smith) »
Bamby P50, Piaggio Ape 50

Big Al

  • Prolific Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4578
  • Ranttweiler, biting the breeze block of banter
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #28 on: October 17, 2015, 09:51:07 AM »
Absolutely. Can we throw the EEC away, please. It doesn't work.
Messerschmitt set, Goggo Darts, Heinkel 175, Fiat Jolly, Autobianchi, Fairthorpe Electron Minor, Borgward, Isuzu Trooper
Citroen BX 17TZD & GTI 16v
Held - MG Magnette ZB & 4/44
For sale - Vellam Isetta, Bamby, AC Type 70, Velorex, Church Pod, Reliant Mk5, KR200,  Saab 96, Bellemy Trials, Citroen BXs

1bubble10 (paul smith)

  • Quite Chatty
  • ****
  • Posts: 122
Re: Worst car in the World? !
« Reply #29 on: October 17, 2015, 10:05:14 AM »
To conclude this - worse car (obviously a subjective topic) - for me anything with an ECU!
Bamby P50, Piaggio Ape 50